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Old 6th Sep 2020, 10:22 pm   #1
bigfathairyvika
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Default Workshop lighting

Posted here as could see a heading for general workshop stuff.

My workshop lighting, currently a CFL bayonet fitting of 8w. Just doesn't light up the place.
I also have a swing arm lamp and a headband led thing but the swing lamp is fixed on one worktop and I keep mis-laying the head lamp or forget to charge it!

But what I really need is a light to really light up the workshop and to have resistor colours appear correct and a bit of clarity when working on stuff.

Does anyone have any tips in choosing the right lighting?
There are so many choices , colour temp, wattage , panel, edge lit, recessed, spot etc

The room is about 10ft x 10ft but only two small windows so daylight is limited.
Worktops are around the edges of three walls.

Mark
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Old 6th Sep 2020, 11:31 pm   #2
60 oldjohn
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Default Re: Workshop lighting

My workshop is also 10' square. Just this last week I have changed a twin tube 5' fluorescent for 2 x 4ft LED batten. I had intended getting a 5' for workshop, but mistakenly ordered 2x 4' so placed end to end. In my opinion 4000k colour is the one to go for. The 5' are 45W, not sure what this means, as they appear to use only 8ma 250v for the 4ft one. No shadows, the only down side is the RF noise on AM. I am not sure if a reputable make would be any better, or if there is a noise figure published anywhere.

John.

PS. I doubt any lighting would give error free reading of the new blue body resistor. I have had wrong values sent through the post. brown or red are very similar as are other colours. .
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Old 7th Sep 2020, 7:14 am   #3
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Default Re: Workshop lighting

I gave up on fluorescent lighting for the workshop, I now use four 600 X 600mm flat LED panels, gives an even illumination.
As John says, the only downside is RF noise on AM.

Peter
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Old 7th Sep 2020, 9:00 am   #4
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Default Re: Workshop lighting

I have an old angle pose lamp that does a good job and looks nice too.
I often use small LED torch with multiple bulbs that can be put inside the chassis (Not live, I hasten to add) to illuminate dark corners for soldering.
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Old 7th Sep 2020, 10:42 am   #5
bigfathairyvika
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Default Re: Workshop lighting

Thanks for the replies.


4000k 45ish watts square panels it is then.

I will try one mounted centrally to start with because it will be easy.

RF hash could be a pain, but I can always use a incandescent lamp when needed. ( my radio operating desk is in the same room)
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Old 7th Sep 2020, 11:15 am   #6
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Default Re: Workshop lighting

I've got one of those panels and it's like the sun coming out when it's on. Very good. If RF noise from the power supply is an issue you could always run it on a linear 1A costant current supply.

Ging
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Old 7th Sep 2020, 11:48 am   #7
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Default Re: Workshop lighting

There's quite a few workshop lighting threads on here, and it's something I've thought a lot about over the years - my workshop is in a cellar with no natural light and very limited headroom. Plus, lighting levels which would have been fine when I was the other side of 40 are no longer adequate

I agree that 4000K is a good colour temperature - that's what I went with. I've always found that 6500K lighting is conspicuously blue. Lower colour temperatures are ideal in the lounge, where you want to relax and wind down at the end of the day, but you need something less yellow for a workshop.

I like the LED panels. I don't yet have them in my workshop, but we're seeing them at work, and they've got quite good in recent times. You can get them in 300mm width, which means they'd fit between the joists in my cellar, which is ideal.

When I last spent money on lighting down there, LEDs were still a way behind fluorescent in terms of light output and quality, so I went for a mixture of T5 and T8 fittings. The latter are standard 100Hz fittings, but because I'm quite sensitive to flicker, I have a high frequency T5 fitting right about the bench - it's good, but the ballast makes a 300V sine (ish!) wave at between 100 and 200kHz, depending on where the brightness control is set. I suspect that this is more troublesome than a modern LED ballast, but haven't tested one extensively. But this T5 ballast can be a problem for audio, let alone RF, and I wouldn't recommend it today.

I made a linear current source to power an LED strip that is also above the bench, under the top shelf. The LEDs are quite old, and not especially bright or nice, but they help to fill in the gloom and give a bit of background light once the HF fluorescent is switched off. In years to come, I'll replace the LEDs with something more modern, but in the meantime, it's a good solution. The PSU is very simple, and runs cool. I haven't got around to writing it up - it's so simple, it hardly seems worth it - but there are some pictures here: https://www.vintage-radio.net/forum/...12#post1202112

Obviously, if RFI is a big concern, this concept can be scaled up as needed. In a cellar, a bit of waste heat is quite welcome, but this might not be the case elsewhere. But it's the only way to get complete freedom from RFI and flicker.

Modern LEDs do have a much better spectrum than fluorescents, and that should help with the modern blue resistor problem - though I agree that they are difficult to read, even in sunlight. But then, they are mostly installed by machine, so being "human readable" is a bit of an afterthought...

Here's a couple of fun videos comparing CFL to LED lamps:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EoAZ-u6hn6g
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nycAujdp708

Obviously there are many more scientific presentations, but those are the ones I always think of!

In general, panels and strips are better than lights and spots. Large areas of light will cast fewer shadows and are less painful to look at. I've re-purposed the plastic diffusers originally used with fluorescent lamps to soften the output from LED strips - otherwise they can make a series of shadows if the LEDs are widely spaced.

Hope this helps,

Mark
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Old 7th Sep 2020, 2:47 pm   #8
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Default Re: Workshop lighting

And whilst making alterations, consider a cheap self contained emergency light. These are widely available for about £20.

Remember that if the power fails, that HT supplies will remain dangerous for some seconds, that power tools will still rotate for some seconds, and soldering irons remain hot for a few minutes.

It might be worth fitting two emergency lights, one over the workbench and one over the door.
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Old 7th Sep 2020, 3:05 pm   #9
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Default Re: Workshop lighting

When I'm buying led lamps for the kitchen or elsewhere in the house I ensure they have a decent colour rendering index (CRI) - at least 90.
I don't know if panels or strips of leds for a workshop are available with a decent CRI but it would certainly help with identification of colours.
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Old 7th Sep 2020, 3:10 pm   #10
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Default Re: Workshop lighting

Quote:
Originally Posted by broadgage View Post
And whilst making alterations, consider a cheap self contained emergency light. These are widely available for about £20.
Just this morning I received a flyer from CPC. Clear emergency light on offer £10.65 each and that includes VAT, not sure about P&P. I have 3 doted around here.

John.
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Old 7th Sep 2020, 3:21 pm   #11
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Default Re: Workshop lighting

Just to add a comment to the conversation when I buy LED bulbs I always go for a minimum of about 800 - 1000 Lumins, I take little notice of the wattage.
However last week I bought a 4 foot batten to add to my workshop lighting but I couldn’t find any reference to Lumins, it only said 8 watts. Any reason why this should be ?
John
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Old 7th Sep 2020, 3:35 pm   #12
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Default Re: Workshop lighting

I was just trying the trick with a CD to assess CRI (see first video in my last post). It's obviously not quantitative, but it gives a surprisingly good insight into the difference between fluorescent and LED light. Even some really quite cheap white LEDs have a surprisingly smooth and continuous spectrum, whereas all fluorescents I have are obviously "stepped" in their colour spectrum.

The numbering scheme for fluorescents indicates CRI and colour temperature - I have 840 in the workshop, where 8 is CRI and 40 means 4000 K. Has that 3-number scheme made it to LED lights yet? Whenever I look in B&Q and the like, you see words like "warm white", "neutral" and "cool white", but if present, actual numbers are hidden away in the small print. I've yet to see anything for CRI, even from the bigger manufacturers like Philips.

Either way, it's clear that the phosphors used in white LEDs create a much more continuous spectrum than fluorescents. Definitely the way to go today

If buying emergency lights, it might be worth considering "maintained" types. They're not usually much more expensive, and it means they can play their part in lighting the space. Definitely a good recommendation if you have a cellar workshop like mine. I bought one ages ago but still haven't got around to fitting it - but I always have a small torch in my pocket, just in case!
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Old 7th Sep 2020, 4:13 pm   #13
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Default Re: Workshop lighting

I am toying with the idea of mounting an exterior type (flat) luminaire made by LAP, in my shed, over the bench. The colour rendering of them is rather good, i have one mounted on the house as garden downlighting illumination. The heatsink on the back only ever gets lukewarm in use. The luminaire is ugly as sin, but does the job.
LAP is one of the brands that show up at Screwfix (could be a subsidiary of Kingfisher/B&Q/Screwfix conglomerate)

Dave
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Old 7th Sep 2020, 4:20 pm   #14
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Default Re: Workshop lighting

Just took a look at Marks post, lots of very interesting stuff well worth a visit.
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Old 7th Sep 2020, 5:10 pm   #15
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Default Re: Workshop lighting

Quote:
Originally Posted by broadgage View Post
And whilst making alterations, consider a cheap self contained emergency light. These are widely available for about £20.
It might be worth fitting two emergency lights, one over the workbench and one over the door.
Like this maybe?
Please don't ask why the junction box is on the ceiling, it's better than dangling choc-blocks!
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Old 7th Sep 2020, 5:20 pm   #16
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Default Re: Workshop lighting

Quote:
Originally Posted by John10b View Post
Just to add a comment to the conversation when I buy LED bulbs I always go for a minimum of about 800 - 1000 Lumins, I take little notice of the wattage.
However last week I bought a 4 foot batten to add to my workshop lighting but I couldn’t find any reference to Lumins, it only said 8 watts. Any reason why this should be ?
John
It could have something to do with comparing it to a fluorescent equivalent.
8W led is roughly equivalent to 60w tungsten.
It's surprising how many people are still following watts instead of migrating to the new lumens system, more watts nowadays equates to more heat production, not light output.
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Old 9th Sep 2020, 8:40 am   #17
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Default Re: Workshop lighting

Thanks all, i have bought one of the 45w panels and at the same time one of the emergency lights.

I shall update with how they fair shortly.
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Old 9th Sep 2020, 10:11 am   #18
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Default Re: Workshop lighting

I have had Led panels for two years now.... one in the main workshop and one in the sub workshop. both are mounted very ugly but functional.. as I dont have suspended ceilings.
they are both 600 X 300...... unfortunately the one in the main workshop has one led out.. showing a dark patch .... but as the light output is still sufficient its ok.
Much better than FLU tubes...immediate start...colour rendering ?? No idea... its light
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Old 9th Sep 2020, 10:29 am   #19
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Default Re: Workshop lighting

Brother fitted up a couple of 20W LED outdoor flood lights, amazing, cheap as well as light levels. This was for a workshop, lathe rather than electronics, but beat fluorescents and low energy fluorescents into a cocked hat.
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Old 9th Sep 2020, 10:56 am   #20
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Default Re: Workshop lighting

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Originally Posted by Wendymott View Post
they are both 600 X 300...... unfortunately the one in the main workshop has one led out.. showing a dark patch .... but as the light output is still sufficient its ok.
Your lucky. My understanding was, one out all out. These must be wired in parallel. I wonder if one LED out will upset the current or voltage supply resulting in the premature failure of the remaining LEDs.

John.
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