26th Apr 2019, 12:36 pm | #801 |
Nonode
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Re: The Audiophoolery Thread.
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26th Apr 2019, 12:41 pm | #802 |
Dekatron
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Re: The Audiophoolery Thread.
The fact that most drivers think they are better than everyone else remind me of the line in Dire Straits "Industrial Disease", at Speaker's Corner:
"Two men say they're Jesus. One of them must be wrong." Regarding tone controls, Doug Self has an interesting design where there is switchable turnover frequencies, and a defeat switch. Or the be-all and end-all, which was the long out of production Cello Audio Palette. Originally designed by Richard Burwen under contract to Mark Levinson. Burwen's design spec, design description, and his implementation is here http://www.burwenaudio.com/images/CE...IO_PALETTE.pdf . Levinson did not like the idea of lots of NE5532's and built the production version using discrete op-amps. Cheap, it was not. Craig |
26th Apr 2019, 2:13 pm | #803 | |
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Re: The Audiophoolery Thread.
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No, but it could be true of most. If there is one really bad driver and 99 equally fair drivers, then the average is below the standard of the equally fair drivers so you have 1 below average and 99 above average. (I'm assuming that 'average' means 'mean' and not 'median' of course). Last edited by kalee20; 26th Apr 2019 at 2:14 pm. Reason: clarification |
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26th Apr 2019, 2:44 pm | #804 | ||
Heptode
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Re: The Audiophoolery Thread.
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26th Apr 2019, 2:56 pm | #805 | |
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Re: The Audiophoolery Thread.
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Craig |
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26th Apr 2019, 11:36 pm | #806 | |
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Re: The Audiophoolery Thread.
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Don't forget it could simply mean someone who takes his/her digging seriously
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27th Apr 2019, 12:10 am | #807 |
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Re: The Audiophoolery Thread.
But next to useless it is as a corrective tool, whatever the quality of the signal path. A few fixed frequencies, fixed Q, and only the amplitude adjustable, in tiny steps. Now something like the Maselec MEQ-2 would have just as clean a signal path [I]and[I] allow you actually to fix problems.
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27th Apr 2019, 3:05 am | #808 | |
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Re: The Audiophoolery Thread.
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I thank Dave for deleting the bit that applies to me BUT as this whole thread says, WHAT constitutes a "phool" ? In my case I love good music! As I type this post I'm listening to Lionel Long, an aussie folk artist of superb talent. BUT he is lost in the past as its "VERY aussie folk" . I guess to give my British friends an idea, its a bit like being a guest at a Morris Wedding, with 30 Morris dancers, ( did I mention two brewers? ) and 100 keen Morris-men and partners?. So, I guess what I say is as my last post, I agree with what Andy has said!! My cables are worth about $15 in total, TT is Garrard 401, Arm is classic SME 3009, Cart is Shure V15, speakers are Tannoy monitor gold 315's in origional boxes, ( Cheviot) amp is my own design n build. Seven watts RMS ( my tests) per channel. SOUND SUPERB, in a word. When I get my cataracts removed ( next month or so) I will continue my build. New separate pre amp, WITH separate power supply, ( incorporates RIAA stuff ) Power amp, about 50 watts RMS per channel ( 4X 5B/254 per channel, ultra linear, or partial triode if you are pedantic) ~ about 14 dB feedback, separate dual mono power supply with massively underrated toroidal power supply same TT, arm and cartridge. I have already overhauled the speakers ( and removed the wave change wafer switch, capable of perhaps 3 mA). It will be my last build!! I hope the speakers will last the last mile!! YES, I am a confirmed Audio-Phool and very proud of it. Like what Andy, and tother Andy said. My best regards to those peeps that measure everything and lose sight of the woods, whilst they are in the trees. Joe |
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27th Apr 2019, 7:07 am | #809 |
Dekatron
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Re: The Audiophoolery Thread.
That is a serious piece of kit, and even second hand seem to cost around £4k. Looks like the most recent version is called the MEA-2 at a list price of £4.45k plus VAT (so £5340 to mere mortals).
Heroic overload margin (29dBu), which corresponds to power supply rails of +/-30-odd volts. The only slight disappointment is the so-so output noise of -95dBu. Since it will almost certainly be part of a digital processing chain, that corresponds merely to Red Book 16-bit LSB. The output noise ought to be a whole lot less than that, certainly with a pro-audio product like that. Craig |
27th Apr 2019, 12:08 pm | #810 |
Octode
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Re: The Audiophoolery Thread.
Hello,
I’ve been occasionally reading this thread. Well, I’ve been working in the hi-fi industry for the last 30 years and the 15 years before that the professional (both PA and guitar amplifier) industry and I feel some of the comments are rather hurtful towards engineers in the audio industry. Primarily my Job role is an electronics engineer but reading some of the posts I feel as I’m also an audio electronics engineer actively working in the audio industry, I’m a kind 'a second-rate electronics engineer - for want of a better phrase. I’ve always felt – on the whole – this to be a welcoming Forum, but of late I feel rather alienated by some of the comments My route into electronics was through playing with radios (or wireless) as young lad but becoming an audio electronics engineer makes me feel I’m not worthy to work with radios, which is my first love. Finally, when I design audio equipment, I use a combination of listening and also using an Audio Precision analyser, scope etc., to track the technical performance. It’s a combination of designing something which fits the required ‘family sound’ which technically performs correctly to enable it to be repeatably made in moderately high quantities. I apologise if I upset anyone. Oh, well I’ve finally said my piece and now I feel I’d better get my coat Over and out. Regards Terry |
27th Apr 2019, 12:24 pm | #811 |
Nonode
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Re: The Audiophoolery Thread.
Please don't get your coat Terry. Your contribution is a refreshing piece of sanity and you should in no way be considered a second rate anything by any member of this forum.
Alan |
27th Apr 2019, 1:58 pm | #812 | ||
Dekatron
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Re: The Audiophoolery Thread.
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This Forum is brilliant, and has members of all sorts of differing skills. There are people whose woodworking and French polishing abilities outstrip their electronics theory. But these abilities are all part of UK Vintage Radio Repair and Restoration, and their input into relevant threads is massively helpful! But they are nevertheless competent at fault-finding and repair. There are people who have a rare experience of low-noise techniques and grasp of the subject. Is that part of vintage radio repair and restoration? Probably not - but reading their posts is like a free lesson to those who are interested (me). No I don't know everything, I'm not yet a 'complete' engineer, I'm still learning too Terry! Voice of sanity is helpful to keep things on track, and the occasional challenge is super. |
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27th Apr 2019, 3:01 pm | #813 | |
Dekatron
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Re: The Audiophoolery Thread.
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Reading how you describe yourself Terry, I fail to see how you would fall into this category. So I don't understand why you're apologising or feeling as if any negativity or mirth is aimed at the likes of you, an experienced, capable audio electronics engineer? Or maybe amongst the 41 pages (that I'm not prepared to check back on) you have said something that you think would class you as an audiophool? Dunno.
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27th Apr 2019, 3:21 pm | #814 |
Dekatron
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Re: The Audiophoolery Thread.
I would cap the cost of equipment below £1000 for all systems that are to be used in a regular living room.
Above that half of the money would need to be spent building a dedicated listening room without any walls that are shared with other properties. I was once asked to fix a pair of speakers and after rebuilding the cross overs there was no improvement. It was the room acoustics. |
27th Apr 2019, 3:21 pm | #815 |
Hexode
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Re: The Audiophoolery Thread.
Don't go Terry,
I for one have learnt an awful lot from fellow club members. Not just technical but grammar too! Some people pay an awful lot of money for the advice openly shared on this forum, I'm still learning and happy to share experiences good or embarrassing! This thread has highlighted another world, some of it I've seen before and shared, some of it just wow! Plus in this thread, there's a fair bit of science from respected members, again, another world revealed. Who knows, one day I may reveal one! Mark
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27th Apr 2019, 6:54 pm | #816 |
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Re: The Audiophoolery Thread.
Stick around Terry.
You have certainly not offended anyone. I got involved with electronics by playing with radios from a very young age... a battery powered valve set when I was about six. I survived boring lessons at school by reading RSGB books, quietly! I developed a passion for building oscilloscopes after I'd saved-up for a couple of years to get an AR88. Inevitably, I wound up in the test equipment business. The transition to designing was made by the time-honoured method of losing my temper with a crappy piece of equipment I was repairing for someone, saying "Hell, *I* could design something better than that!" and then proceeding to do so. For some reason, the domestic hifi business seems to have collected an amazing amount of not just snake oil but also out-and-out bull. It isn't a victimless crime. I have a lot of sympathy for the victims, those who have only come across the snake-lubricated side of things and have been led into believing all sorts of unsubstantiated and even just plain wrong stuff. If I hear something unexpected, I want to know what and why and I will burrow away until I have found and verified a rational explanation. The professional audio industry has to be rational to be able to operate, but then it has to keep happy its clients.... recording artists with sometimes some rather strange ideas. The people on here like the rational side of things. Ohms law etc work, and work the same for everyone. Some of the wilder end of the irrational is quite funny. David
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27th Apr 2019, 8:41 pm | #817 | |
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Re: The Audiophoolery Thread.
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There is (at least) one thing a "listening test" does, weeds out the the odd and infrequent misbehaviour of a system, a big "clunk" once in a while tha would not be picked up (or more likely not noted by the technician) for example. My current amplifier for the HiFi one of those 15 pin "huge transistor" stereo IC jobs in a die cast box, works well and (dare I say) "sounds" as good as anything I have had. The "pre amp" is just a switch and pot affair, remote controlled by RF (saves all that pointing around of the remote), I used to have tone controls but all the available twiddling took away the time to enjoy the programme. The very best improvement in my "HiFi" is the remote balance control, great for tweaking the "sound stage" centre to make a radio play fit properly. Oops, I have strayed off topic being rational... |
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27th Apr 2019, 8:50 pm | #818 |
Dekatron
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Re: The Audiophoolery Thread.
Quite correct, intended as a repository for the more outlandish products that otherwise get a mention in other threads and then subsequently forgotten, hence the thread title. As is the way here, it has drifted somewhat, and many of the posts are of a more serious nature.
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27th Apr 2019, 9:17 pm | #819 |
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Re: The Audiophoolery Thread.
If this was a REAL audiophile thread, we'd all have to list every item of equipment we have (or ever have had) including every stand, cable and piece of geology in the footer of every posting...
David
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28th Apr 2019, 12:42 am | #820 | |
Octode
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Re: The Audiophoolery Thread.
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