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Old 4th Aug 2021, 11:38 pm   #1
EF80TVVALVE
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Default Ultra V17-60 Television

Hi all

I picked this set up today, it was free - on the condition that the taker lifted it out of the loft where it had rested since the early 1970s. It came down with a struggle, eventually balanced on my head with hands supporting it, quite a feat for a bulky 17" set!

Once home I snipped the mains filter cap and slowly applied power with a Variac, after getting past half way I could start to hear the line whistle and when finally at full power I had a bright raster, lacking a little in width and height. Signal from the Aurora shows the vertical hold cannot be adjusted correctly and turning the control to the upper end causes the raster to collapse into one vertical line in the centre of the screen.

Lots of cracked hunts to replace but it looks as though it will be a fairly easy restoration with good results. The cabinet will present nicely once I remove 50 years of dirt (it is caked in black sooty dust) and the plastic screen surround was found broken nearby so this will be glued and refitted. It
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Old 5th Aug 2021, 8:33 am   #2
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Default Re: Ultra V17-60 Television

One of Ultra's best receivers. Mazda CRM172 CRT, again one of Mazda's best! The Ultra badge on the front was replaced by a magic eye on the FM radio models. The picture quality is equal to a Murphy V310. John.
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Old 5th Aug 2021, 9:43 am   #3
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Default Re: Ultra V17-60 Television

Thanks for the info John, I'm looking forward to completing the work. It's nice to have a first light such as this as it gives promising signs that it will be a good set. I know it was used until the early 1970s as the lady who had it remembered putting it in the loft - mum's orders apparently! I think the large loft hatch was this sets saving grace, otherwise I doubt it would have remained forgotten about for so long.

Cheers
Bren
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Old 5th Aug 2021, 1:00 pm   #4
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Default Re: Ultra V17-60 Television

Excellent save, Bren! I saw that pop up and wondered what the chances were of the missing moulding from around the screen being in the loft too. Perhaps the heat and cold up there over the past 50 years caused it to crack and fall off. Is it a bakelite cased set? I'd be interested to see a better picture of it.

Steve
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Old 5th Aug 2021, 2:02 pm   #5
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Default Re: Ultra V17-60 Television

Thanks Steve,
I tried my hardest to resist but it was literally 5 minutes from my house, eventually I caved and picked it up after work! It's a plywood case with bakelite speaker grille, screen surround and dial surround, I'll take some more photos after the clean up, it really is a mucky old thing at the minute. The damage to the surround may have been done when putting it into the loft, apparently it took three people and was quite a struggle, it will repair well enough and certainly better than it being missing completely.
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Old 5th Aug 2021, 10:26 pm   #6
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Default Re: Ultra V17-60 Television

A bit of an update from tonights work. I began with changing most of the cracked hunts capacitors on the underside of the chassis, along with a few wax caps too. I wasn't expecting much improvement yet and so far there has been none - screen results are still the same as yesterday, from tomorrow I'll be paying particular attention to the time base circuits and hopefully get some sort of synced picture on the screen.

The cabinet is starting to clean up but no photos of the results yet. This dust/muck is proving very difficult to get off but it's slowly getting there. Hopefully in a few days time I'll be able to upload some photos of a fairly nice looking set!
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Old 6th Aug 2021, 11:16 am   #7
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Default Re: Ultra V17-60 Television

The circuit diagram for the Ultra V17-60 can be found in the 1957/58 Radio and Television servicing book. Pages 607 to 609.
With a good CRT this set should be capable of displaying excellent pictures.
The vision AGC is of the frame gated type. The black level is sampled during the frame blanking period.
The tuner is the Ultra "sliding turret" type.

DFWB.
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Old 6th Aug 2021, 11:37 am   #8
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Default Re: Ultra V17-60 Television

Thanks Fernseh, I do have a BRTR sheet for it (as in the above photograph) which should serve me well enough. I haven't touched any of the tuner/RF side of the set yet but I can see a good signal coming through so I'll wait until I have a stable picture on the screen.

I forgot to add the CRT is a regun, I can't remember the name well but I found the label in the cabinet so I'll photograph and attach tonight. The set must have been in regular use into the 1970s, most of the valves look well used and the selenium rectifier & HT Smoothing/reservoir are later replacements, particularly the rectifier which looks very late 1960s and still almost brand new.
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Old 6th Aug 2021, 3:26 pm   #9
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Default Re: Ultra V17-60 Television

Good work Bren. I don't think I've ever seen one of these sets featured on the forum before. Really glad you saved it.

I wonder how Ultra's numbering works. What's the difference between a V17-60 and a W17-50 for example?

Steve
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Old 6th Aug 2021, 10:34 pm   #10
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Default Re: Ultra V17-60 Television

Regarding serial numbers, I know that 17 indicates the screen size and 60 is the chassis series number. Its possible that V could be for table sets and W for consoles but I'm not too certain on that one.

Some more work completed this evening, while I had the chassis out of the cabinet I gave the screen, mask and safety glass a clean. Particular attention was paid to the time bases and tonight I have full height returned to the set. The vertical sync is still off, it actually looks like there may be a break in the pot as over one section EHT seems to dissappear causing the vertical line that fades away, moving the wiper just past this (it's right and the end of the pot) the unsynced raster returns. I'll do more investigation tomorrow.

Funnily enough turning down the Variac bring the picture into sync so I've attached the first test card it's displayed in many years, I know it's cheating a little but things are certainly getting there.
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Old 6th Aug 2021, 10:38 pm   #11
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Default Re: Ultra V17-60 Television

Nice one, looking very good so far
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Old 7th Aug 2021, 6:55 pm   #12
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Default Re: Ultra V17-60 Television

Well today I have done a little more to the set, firstly replacement of all the remaining hunts mouldseal type capacitors (well, most I have replacements for). After some investigation I found a high resistor between the horizontal hold and valve (I got my axes wrong on the previous posts). That has now cured the horizontal hold problem, although travel is still very far up so a little more investigation is due soon.

There is still a lot more to do, I now have a good test card but there are bars running up and down in the background and a little shakeyness of the picture here and there. The tuner is also very mucky causing signal loss and scratchy tuning (in fact most pots are like this too) so a lot of cleaning needs to continue and replacement of a few more components but it's coming along very well.

Just for the record I've added the label of the regunners - not a company I've heard of before but there again I believe there were a lot of small regunners around in the 1950s/1960s.
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Old 7th Aug 2021, 7:46 pm   #13
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Default Re: Ultra V17-60 Television

Never used Electro High Vacuum tubes myself. In the sixties I'd often come across TV sets fitted with tubes of that brand. Never had any problems with the firm's tubes.
Getting back to the Ultra V17-60 the cabinet styling was quite a departure from the box like TV sets which were the norm in those times.
EF80TVVALVE wrote: "There is still a lot more to do, I now have a good test card but there are bars running up and down in the background and a little shakeyness of the picture here and there."
The frame gated vision AGC system needs very long time constants in the filtering to remove any 50Hz component so attention should be drawn to that part of the circuit.

DFWB.

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Old 8th Aug 2021, 3:43 pm   #14
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Default Re: Ultra V17-60 Television

Thanks Fernseh, the CRT does look to be good and I'm sure as with any other types of this age it will come up much better after a few hours. There are still a few mouldseal caps to replace and one waxie which has obviously been getting stressed from operating the set (I'm just waiting for an order to turn up). I'll be starting the clean up of switches and pots today just so they're clear of any poor contact.

I'm currently cleaning up the cabinet which I've been at for a few hours now, as well as making repairs to the screen surround, I'll probably fill in any remaining cracks and repaint as it is in poor shape currently. It looks as though it was pulled off in order to clean behind the glass, damaged and glued many years ago.

I'll have to think of a way to re-attach to the cabinet as all clip are broken, probably a light bostick type glue where it can be easily removed if needed.
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Old 8th Aug 2021, 5:39 pm   #15
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Default Re: Ultra V17-60 Television

I have never encountered an 'Electro High Vacuum' but they were obviously very good rebuilders. Crazy situation, the rebuilders manage to re gun a tube and it lasted longer than the original manufacturers item.
The original makers had a huge back up in well equipped factories. A lot of these small rebuilders that did excellent work carried out that work in garages, sheds and all manner of odd buildings. My mate John [Central Tubes] started originally in a Victorian horse stable and ended up with a large factory in Mitcham. RIP John your sadly missed. Regards, John.
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Old 10th Aug 2021, 9:20 pm   #16
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Default Re: Ultra V17-60 Television

Hi all

I've done a little more work on the ultra this evening, things are improving and nearly all of the hunts mouldseal and wax caps are now replaced with good results.

The picture is beginning to look very nice but I'm still having a problem with some shaking of the line scan. Switching to a blank raster it looks as though there are some thin, dark bars running rapidly upwards in the background causing the line scan to jump and vary in distance from one another. These bars look different to the types mentioned earlier on which were large darker bars moving slowly behind the picture causing a slight 'breathing' effect. This is where I'll be focusing the next steps.

I'm going to start with checking the contacts on the valves and sockets before investigating within the circuit as a lot of connections are corroded from the years of loft storage and no doubt some valves have less than ideal contact with their holders. I've attached a photo of the offending lines on a blank raster.

Other than this it's been very responsive to all of the work done, I'm looking forward to seeing it finished!
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Old 11th Aug 2021, 6:40 pm   #17
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Default Re: Ultra V17-60 Television

Check that the CRT external coating is earthed to chassis. It looks like the line rate is modulating the EHT. J.
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Old 11th Aug 2021, 9:14 pm   #18
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Default Re: Ultra V17-60 Television

Thanks John I'll be sure to give this a check when I next do a bit of work on it. I've noticed that the IF valves are suffering from poor contact which looks to be contributing to the erratic line structure, giving them all a wiggle will cure it for some time so I'm going to clean up the pins and see if that helps improve things too. I'll report back with the results of all the above soon.
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Old 14th Aug 2021, 9:01 pm   #19
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Default Re: Ultra V17-60 Television

Just a brief note on Electro High Vacuum tubes.
They were tube re-manufacturers at the old Darley Abbey mills on the outskirts of Derby in the 1960's .
Excellent tubes, which the firm I was working for used frequently.
Quite cheap, but every one a "Gud 'un" as they say.
I bought quite a few from there.
We were always served by the buxom, cheerfull, and knowledgeable Mrs Tandy. Tony.
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Old 15th Aug 2021, 11:01 am   #20
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Default Re: Ultra V17-60 Television

Quote:
Originally Posted by EF80TVVALVE View Post
The picture is beginning to look very nice but I'm still having a problem with some shaking of the line scan.
Is it not the frame scan that is shaky rather than the line scan?

Peter
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