UK Vintage Radio Repair and Restoration Powered By Google Custom Search Vintage Radio and TV Service Data

Go Back   UK Vintage Radio Repair and Restoration Discussion Forum > Specific Vintage Equipment > Vintage Television and Video

Notices

Vintage Television and Video Vintage television and video equipment, programmes, VCRs etc.

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old 20th Jul 2006, 12:37 pm   #1
Aerodyne
Octode
 
Aerodyne's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Hampton Vale, Peterborough, UK.
Posts: 1,698
Default What happened to DER?

Anyone know? I left them in 1973. They were in good order at the time! I've heard conflicting stories about buy-outs, but would dearly love to know why my leaving caused such trauma
Seriously, though, can you fill in the gaps between the early '70s and the final closure? Assuming it IS a final closure, of course.
-Tony
Aerodyne is offline  
Old 20th Jul 2006, 12:57 pm   #2
ppppenguin
Retired Dormant Member
 
ppppenguin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: North London, UK.
Posts: 6,168
Default Re: What happened to DER?

ISTR the business was absorbed into Radio Rentals in the 1980s (DER and RR were both part of the Thorn group) as part of a rationalisation as the rental market declined. RR as a brand disappeared in the 1990s and the rental business is now dead except for a couple of specialist sectors. The main one is private rented accommodation where it is sometimes useful for the landlord to contract out the provision of white and brown goods.
ppppenguin is offline  
Old 20th Jul 2006, 1:10 pm   #3
mickjjo
Rest in Peace
 
mickjjo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Dartford, Kent, UK.
Posts: 1,661
Default Re: What happened to DER?

There is a document here which may be interesting:-

http://www.sustainablepss.org/casest...ls/rentals.php

Looks like all the rental companies merged and were owned by Thorn. Quite a tangled web but "Box Clever" may be the only rental company left, although my local branch closed a couple of years ago.

Regards, Mick.
mickjjo is offline  
Old 20th Jul 2006, 1:33 pm   #4
Mike Phelan
Dekatron
 
Mike Phelan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Near Leeds, West Yorkshire, UK
Posts: 4,609
Default Re: What happened to DER?

As Jeffrey says, they joined THEI (Thorn Home Entertainment Industry) which later became TTVVC (Thorn Television and Video Centres) about 1985 (forgettory hazy here). I think it was after Multibroadcast and before Rumbelows; only MB and Focus/Easiview retained the brands for any length of time.
I worked for TTVVC until 1991.
Useless info; most places had 3-digit shop/depot codes - they all added a fourth digit depenting on the source - Focus was 5, MB 4, etc.
__________________
Mike.
Mike Phelan is offline  
Old 20th Jul 2006, 7:14 pm   #5
Aerodyne
Octode
 
Aerodyne's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Hampton Vale, Peterborough, UK.
Posts: 1,698
Default Re: What happened to DER?

Afew years back I saw an advert for rental TVs from 'DER DIRECT' but that seems to have hit the skids, too.
Many thanks, Jeff, Mike and Mick. I'll follow the link, Mick. I often wonder what the dickens I'd have done with my life if I hadn't managed to stay a step or two ahead of the inevitable, something I achieved several times, as I'm sure many on this forum will also have had to do.
-Tony
Aerodyne is offline  
Old 20th Jul 2006, 7:19 pm   #6
Aerodyne
Octode
 
Aerodyne's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Hampton Vale, Peterborough, UK.
Posts: 1,698
Default Re: What happened to DER?

I've scanned that link. Interesting stuff, but is it factually spot on? As I understood it, Robinson's Rentals and Radio Rentals were two separate concerns. Certainly, in York where I lived in the 1960s, there were two distinct branches - not that it proves much, of course.
-Tony
Aerodyne is offline  
Old 20th Jul 2006, 11:55 pm   #7
Mike Fulton
Pentode
 
Mike Fulton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: 7 Miles North of Durham, UK.
Posts: 130
Default Re: What happened to DER?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ppppenguin
the rental business is now dead except for a couple of specialist sectors.
Hmmmm... Think Martin might not quite be with you on that one, he seems to be doing all right for himself

http://www.martindawes.com/

Problem with the Thorn group was always the same, too many chiefs and way too many indians!!
Mike Fulton is offline  
Old 21st Jul 2006, 9:12 am   #8
AndiiT
Octode
 
AndiiT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Saltburn-East, Cleveland, UK.
Posts: 1,786
Default Re: What happened to DER?

Hi,
As an ex - DER/Thorn employee this is what happened in my case (and presumably in other areas too) Around 1985/6 (I am not sure of exact dates/years so might be a few years out here) the servicing leg of Multibroadcast/Focus branches merged with DER branches, but for a while the shops still traded on the high street as seperate entities (as I recall) shortly afterwards (maybe 18 months to two years later) the combined DER/Multibroadcast/Focus service operation was merged with Radio Rentals and around the same time the DER and Multibroadcast/Focus shops began to dissapear leaving only Radio Rentals trading on the high street.

After many changes in where the service operations were based (i.e. within the stores or at a dedicated service depot) the servicing leg became known as Thorn Homeserve and some time afterwards took on the servicing (and some of the service staff) of Rumbelows equipment, Rumbelows being part(?) owned by Thorn at the time; this meant that Thorn had two major high street traders Radio Rentals, dealing with (you've guessed it) Rentals, and Rumblelows concentrating on the retail side of things.

Over a period of time all the Rumbelows branches dissapeared and by this time Radio Rentals had begun to sell as well as rent sets, including the take over of the Co-operative society rentals too.

Thorn Homeserve continued as the service unit and employed a mixture of DER, Radio Rentals, Multibroadcast/Focus and Rumbelows employees.
Some time after I left Thorn, Granada rentals servicing operations and Thorn Homeserve merged and became Box Clever.

I am not sure if Box Clever is still around though, I did hear a while ago from and ex-Thorn colleague that the only staff left at Box Clever were the ones that were originally Rumbelows service technicians.

As an aside and hopefully not too far OT I was once told that the three Thorn rental operations were aimed at different areas of the rental market, Multibroadcast being aimed at the more "affluent" customer, Radio Rentals being more "middle of the road" and DER being aimed at the lower end of the rental market.

My current manager is one of my ex - Radio Rentals colleagues!!

Andrew
AndiiT is offline  
Old 21st Jul 2006, 12:18 pm   #9
Aerodyne
Octode
 
Aerodyne's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Hampton Vale, Peterborough, UK.
Posts: 1,698
Default Re: What happened to DER?

Useful info, Andrew - thanks for that. I can see what you mean about the market sector divisions - though when I worked for DER we ran the gamut from the poshest of the posh (Colonels in country mansions) to single-parent bedsit slot-TV land. Certainly the clientele quality started to drop off before I left...
I wonder also what happened as the rental market contracted to collapse point. Where are all those surplus engineers employed? They surely can't all have stayed in TV servicing as there just isn't the call any more, nor has there been for a long time past. How many went into business as one-man bands on the fringes of commercialism (I tried that for a few years, with my own TV, video and Hi-Fi shop, but it was hard going competing with the high street), how many left the trade and so on?
I think the history of rental TV would make a good book - or possibly a good horror film
-Tony
Aerodyne is offline  
Old 21st Jul 2006, 12:21 pm   #10
ppppenguin
Retired Dormant Member
 
ppppenguin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: North London, UK.
Posts: 6,168
Default Re: What happened to DER?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aerodyne
I think the history of rental TV would make a good book - or possibly a good horror film
Think of "The Setmakers", that chronicle of the failings of British industry.
ppppenguin is offline  
Old 21st Jul 2006, 12:31 pm   #11
mickjjo
Rest in Peace
 
mickjjo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Dartford, Kent, UK.
Posts: 1,661
Default Re: What happened to DER?

Another interesting site here:-

http://www.transdiffusion.org/emc/ha...0s/rentals.php

Renting TV sets etc, has not made economic sense for the public for years.

Regards, Mick.
mickjjo is offline  
Old 21st Jul 2006, 12:33 pm   #12
Aerodyne
Octode
 
Aerodyne's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Hampton Vale, Peterborough, UK.
Posts: 1,698
Default Re: What happened to DER?

Yep, I know of that, Jeffery, but I was thinking more along the lines of a dedicated 'rental' tome - or come to think of it, maybe a 'carry on Renting' film. Unfortunately for the latter, the original cast are either dead or heading into senility. Speaking of which, where am I?

Just read the article by Glenn Aylett. Very clear and concise. Thanks for that, Mick.
Tony
Aerodyne is offline  
Old 21st Jul 2006, 1:17 pm   #13
ppppenguin
Retired Dormant Member
 
ppppenguin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: North London, UK.
Posts: 6,168
Default Re: What happened to DER?

Quote:
Originally Posted by mickjjo
Another interesting site here
A nice description of the decline of rental. It's part of a much larger website that looks very interesting. Must bookmark it.

My mention of "The Setmakers", was merely to note that a book on the rental industry would be an equally sad record of failure. Thinking again I'm not quite so sure. The rental industry was immensely successful for a few decades and its decline probably has more to do with economic and technical progress rather than bungled management.
ppppenguin is offline  
Old 21st Jul 2006, 9:27 pm   #14
AndiiT
Octode
 
AndiiT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Saltburn-East, Cleveland, UK.
Posts: 1,786
Default Re: What happened to DER?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aerodyne
though when I worked for DER we ran the gamut from the poshest of the posh (Colonels in country mansions) to single-parent bedsit slot-TV land. Certainly the clientele quality started to drop off before I left
We too on Teesside had a fair cross section of customers at DER, it was suggested by a (now ex DER) colleague that the three Thorn rental outlets were aimed at different parts of the market, and this could be sometimes seen in the cosmetic variances between certain models produced for the three companies.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aerodyne
Where are all those surplus engineers employed? They surely can't all have stayed in TV servicing as there just isn't the call any more, nor has there been for a long time past. How many went into business as one-man bands on the fringes of commercialism (I tried that for a few years, with my own TV, video and Hi-Fi shop, but it was hard going competing with the high street), how many left the trade and so on?
As I mentioned my current manager is one of my ex-Radio Rentals/Thorn Homeserve colleagues, also one of my workmates is an ex-Thorn "surplus" engineer - we all work for what used to be a local cable television and telecoms company but is now owned by ntl - some of the old Thorn office staff are also working there in the fault support call centre or admin departments.

I know of at least three engineers who went into business as one-man bands, the above mentioned workmate included (who packed in about three years ago and joined ntl); the other two are surviving (just) but the last time I spoke to the one I keep in regular contact with he was looking for an alternative.

One of the Radio Rentals chaps I worked with only had one arm and strangely enough followed me round two of the jobs I had after being made redundant by Thorn (I prefer to think of it as being given money to stay away ) As I left these jobs he seemed to step in to my shoes....and the last time I saw him he was part retired and building computers to earn a crust.

I am certain that many of the engineers that I worked with in my Thorn days must have diversified if not retired and, sadly, I know of at least three who have committed suicide.

Andrew
AndiiT is offline  
Old 22nd Jul 2006, 3:50 pm   #15
Aerodyne
Octode
 
Aerodyne's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Hampton Vale, Peterborough, UK.
Posts: 1,698
Default Re: What happened to DER?

I know for certain only of one who committed suicide, but I have a feeling that either the workload generated suicidal tendencies after years of struggle - or only those slightly unhinged (like me) in the first place were attracted to the job. When I said I was looking for work in the trade, I was told by one well-seasoned veteran that I was mad to even consider it.
Was he right? Dunno, it was quite an experience and did enjoy the challenges but I don't think I'd want to repeat it. Once was more than enough!
-Tony
Aerodyne is offline  
Old 22nd Jul 2006, 11:03 pm   #16
Nickthedentist
Dekatron
 
Nickthedentist's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Oxford, UK.
Posts: 17,820
Default Re: What happened to DER?

On a happier note, the chap who services our autoclave and x-ray set is an ex-serviceman for one of the big rental companies. He always has interesting stories (e.g. how the storage heaters were always covered with wet TX9 chassis, which were drying out after being washed in hot soapy water to get rid of nicotine deposits).

Nick.
Nickthedentist is offline  
Old 24th Jul 2006, 8:48 pm   #17
Heatercathodeshort
Dekatron
 
Heatercathodeshort's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Warnham, West Sussex. 10 miles south of DORKING.
Posts: 9,145
Default Re: What happened to DER?

DER had their headquarters in a black tower block on the Twickenham Road called 'APEX HOUSE' The corner were it stood [now demolished] is still known as APEX CORNER. It was the night setting for that terrible remake of the original 1933 film King Kong. KONGA was made at Merton Park Studios around 1960 and Apex House was the back drop to one of the night scenes but you could still make out the DER trade mark half way up the wall! Regards John.
Heatercathodeshort is offline  
Old 24th Jul 2006, 9:23 pm   #18
bobhowe
Heptode
 
bobhowe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Sunderland, Tyne and Wear, UK.
Posts: 661
Default Re: What happened to DER?

Hi
The answer to Andiit; Box Clever is still around
bobhowe is offline  
Old 25th Jul 2006, 8:48 am   #19
Mike Phelan
Dekatron
 
Mike Phelan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Near Leeds, West Yorkshire, UK
Posts: 4,609
Default Re: What happened to DER?

When THEI split their HQ away from the rest of Thorn at Swindon, they used Apex House pending the move to Bracknell - I remember flying down there from Leeds-Bradford about every 2 to 3 weeks to set up some of their systems, including a massive financial forecasting model that I wrote.
I got to know the names of all the BM pilots on the DC9s!

Curiously, many of the black cab drivers did not know where Apex Corner was.

THEI then set up shop at Bracknell, next door to the Met Office, later to a temporary office in the same town, then finally to Theale, near the M4. The costs for all this must have been horrendous, and signalled the beginning of the end. I was privileged to be able see all the figures in the nominal ledger as I was working on it - all 900 or so accounts.
__________________
Mike.
Mike Phelan is offline  
Old 3rd Oct 2013, 12:03 pm   #20
GarySampson
Retired Dormant Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Johannesburg, South Africia.
Posts: 1
Default Re: What happened to DER?

My dad, Leslie Sampson worked at DER (by day), and at 'The Castle' (Richmond) by night (playing bass). I remember DER (APEX House), and the computer room my dad worked in, what a laugh by todays' standard. Great big Date Reel tapes to capture the data of all the rental subscribers.
GarySampson is offline  
Closed Thread

Thread Tools



All times are GMT +1. The time now is 8:48 pm.


All information and advice on this forum is subject to the WARNING AND DISCLAIMER located at https://www.vintage-radio.net/rules.html.
Failure to heed this warning may result in death or serious injury to yourself and/or others.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Copyright ©2002 - 2023, Paul Stenning.