BT to shut down PSTN by 2025

[Glowing Bits!]

Sorry for hijacking this thread, what happens to phones if there is a direct fibre line brought in to the house? Does the phone still work or will it need a mains supply?
If the latter, that's no good If there's an emergency and there's a power cut.

[ms660]

Originally Posted by Glowing Bits!

Sorry for hijacking this thread, what happens to phones if there is a direct fibre line brought in to the house? Does the phone still work or will it need a mains supply?
If the latter, that's no good If there's an emergency and there's a power cut.

We had FTTP installed (Openreach) 'phone landline was left as it was so 'phone still workie workie.

Lawrence.

[Glowing Bits!]

Was that with a separate copper wire or just straight fibre with no more copper ever again?
Now I'm intrigued.

[duncanlowe]

Originally Posted by ms660

We had FTTP installed (Openreach) 'phone landline was left as it was so 'phone still workie workie.

Lawrence.

But what about new installations, where FTTP has been put in when built? My parents moved in to a new place in October 2019, and it is FTTP. I'm pretty sure the telephone sockets are connected to the fibre modem and nothing else. For them, in the event of a power cut, it's irrelevant because their only phones are cordless so would be dead anyway. Maybe there's an assumption that since cordless phones are so widespread, they make it a moot point?
To overcome a similar concern my cordless phone base station, as well as the VDSL modem are supported by a UPS, as is the modem router upstairs.

[Glowing Bits!]

That confirms what I thought, it won't work.
At least I can keep myself warm if there's a house fire during a power cut!

[ms660]

Originally Posted by Glowing Bits!

Was that with a separate copper wire or just straight fibre with no more copper ever again?
Now I'm intrigued.

When we bought the house the copper landline was present as was a bog standard 'phone that plugs into the landline socket.....one day we decided to have FTTP installed, Openreach came out and installed FTTP, the copper landline was left as it was, the WIFI hub plugs into the fiber modem and the 'phone was left as it was still plugged into the landline outlet so it's still workie workie as it always did which suits me fine.

Lawrence.

[G6Tanuki]

Originally Posted by ms660

When we bought the house the copper landline was present as was a bog standard 'phone that plugs into the landline socket.....one day we decided to have FTTP installed, Openreach came out and installed FTTP, the copper landline was left as it was, the WIFI hub plugs into the fiber modem and the 'phone was left as it was still plugged into the landline outlet so it's still workie workie as it always did which suits me fine.

Lawrence.

Do you still have to pay anything for the copper? Are you getting your broadband service from BT or from someone-else? I can see that there may be issues if you want to get your broadband from a non-BT provider; you may end up having to manage 2 contracts/have two bills, one for your BB and one for provision of and calls on your legacy POTS connection.

Some new-build houses here have no provision for wired Internet/phones at all; they're part of a 5G pilot-project and from talking to the residents they think it's great!

[ms660]

Originally Posted by G6Tanuki

Do you still have to pay anything for the copper? Are you getting your broadband service from BT or from someone-else? I can see that there may be issues if you want to get your broadband from a non-BT provider; you may end up having to manage 2 contracts/have two bills, one for your BB and one for provision of and calls on your legacy POTS connection

One bill, I doubt I'll switch providers, don't see the point, they're all on the same money tree game, if one was so fantastically cheap and the others didn't respond then most comms companies would be out of business, same with electricity, I went on one of those comparison sites......said I could (could being the operative word) save a few quid per year, nothing spectacular....not worth the hassle for me but each to their own.

Lawrence.

[Tim]

Manufacturers support for the current generation of BT PSTN exchanges ( System X and AXE10) will be discontinued after 2025. Existing PSTN customers will have to go VOIP. This can/will be provided over the existing copper network for the time being. There are already “ internet only” circuits available, which don’t have any DC conditions on them at all. (If that’s a wise thing is not for this post). I don’t know if there is any difference in cost between one of these and a line that also has PSTN service.
I can’t speak for other service providers.

[Nuvistor]

Will the copper still be used and FTTC used over the copper to provide broadband and VOIP?

[Tim]

Copper will still be used from Cab to customer for the foreseeable future. The only difference is post 2025 there probably won’t be “ traditional “ dial tone. As others have already pointed out, some service providers offer a hub into which a landline phone can be plugged, so it will still be possible to use old phones. They will simply work in a different way.

[Tim]

Rick. The current FTTC service uses the existing copper line to your premises. The internet part arrives at the cabinet( well, nearby street DSLAM actually) by optic fibre. Your existing copper line is then routed through the DSLAM, and has the Broadband “mixed” onto it. POTS and Broadband are then delivered the last bit by your copper line.
There is an FTTP ( Fibre to the Premises), which is a direct fibre service but I don’t know much about that.

[Cobaltblue]

Originally Posted by Tim

Copper will still be used from Cab to customer for the foreseeable future. The only difference is post 2025 there probably won’t be “ traditional “ dial tone. As others have already pointed out, some service providers offer a hub into which a landline phone can be plugged, so it will still be possible to use old phones. They will simply work in a different way.

When I was looking to move to BT they were going to remove the existing (although unused) copper and replace it with fibre only.
As mentioned in #5
They were not offering a conventional plug in telephone even via their router.

Cheers

Mike T

[G6Tanuki]

Part of the point of the "FTTC rollout" has always been to perform voice-digitisation in the cabinets (for legacy voice-only phones) rather than retaining a vast bundle of - often aged and failing - copper-pairs back to the exchange.
This has taken quite a few years longer than originally they expected - and has effectively been overtaken by technology! So now the voice-digitisation is being moved to the customer's premises and it's then a digital-only fibre-path-all-the-way-back-to-the-exchange.

[dsergeant]

But the fact remains that very few routers have provision for plugging a normal (ie DECT) phone in, although you can buy VOIP adaptor units. Or for that matter the VOIP phone maintaining the same land line number you have used for donkey's years. I for one very much still use my landline as the main way to keep in touch (dumb mobile normally turned off). I am very concerned that the phone companies have given very little consideration and publicity for what is a major change.

Dave

[Nuvistor]

Originally Posted by dsergeant

I am very concerned that the phone companies have given very little consideration and publicity for what is a major change.

Dave

There have been rumbling in the National press since about 2004 but it is about two years ago that a cutoff date seems to have been announced. I have only seen it in the technical press but I could have missed it in the National press.
Perhaps the decision was made for them with the discontinued support for the present tech as noted by Tim in post# 29.

Unless they bring a fibre to your property they will perhaps use the present copper with a suitable router that will work with older phones so you may find little difference. With the green cabinets holding the required hardware.

I can’t see them bringing fibre to my house when FTTC is available if I wanted it.
I will worry about it when it happens, I am not with BT but my provider uses Openreach copper.

Couple of interesting posts in this thread, last two posts from 12 months ago. 5000 exchanges won’t be required.
https://www.vintage-radio.net/forum/...d.php?t=163847

[Michael Maurice]

I was told of an advantage and that is to do with call disconnect. At the moment, if you are called and the caller does not hang up then even if the recipient of the call disconnects the call, the line will still be active.

This allows the scammers to fool the recipient.

I understand that this will end in 2025

[Station X]

That's the Called Sub Held (CSH) time out which was reduced in length relatively recently to combat that form of fraud.

Historically calls could only be released by the caller. The timer would then release a call if the caller failed to hang up.

[WaveyDipole]

What prompted me to post the op was an e-mail from my router provider, Draytek, a few days ago which read:

"In 2025, all analogue phone lines in the UK will be turned off. DrayTek is having a free online webinar to explain exactly what’s happening, everything that this major change will affect and what you’ll need to do to prepare. "

I registered, but unfortunately missed the webinar. I have e-mailed that to ask whether there is a recording that one can access.

My main concern was mum who has a landline and doesn't want or understand an Internet service. Her mobile phone is pay as you go ("for emergencies") so she relies on her landline for most part to keep in touch.

[Dave Moll]

From what has been said so far within this thread, it would appear that Draytek's statement is not entirely accurate or at least is rather misleading, so it would certainly be interesting to know what they say in their webinar.