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Old 7th Aug 2013, 10:48 am   #1
SteveCG
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Default Where was the mains voltage 140 Volts AC ?

Over the years I've seen some older equipment with quite a range of voltage taps on the mains transformer. For those covering from 100 to 130 and 200 to 250 I can place possible countries. But I've not come across a country with a mains voltage of 140V or even 145V. Can others enlighten me please?

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Old 7th Aug 2013, 10:57 am   #2
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Default Re: Where was the mains voltage 140 Volts AC ?

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Originally Posted by SteveCG View Post
Over the years I've seen some older equipment with quite a range of voltage taps on the mains transformer. For those covering from 100 to 130 and 200 to 250 I can place possible countries. But I've not come across a country with a mains voltage of 145 V. Can others enlighten me please?
Some parts of the USA apparently have had (and some even still have) voltages into the 140s - perhaps the tapping was there for local variations to protect the equipment in a particularly high voltage area (the user being expected to check or measure what is coming out of the sockets).

I understand considerable local voltage variations were commonplace throughout the 20th century, even within different parts of countries -n my high school teacher said the Southern Electricity Board had to replace every motor in the metalwork and woodwork shops as the voltage in Reading changed from 200 to 240, (wihch ties up with a list of voltages I have in an old book) and below is a newspaper cutting from Philips warning to check lamps for use in Den Haag due to different voltages being used to the rest of NL.

Until the 1990s some areas of Penang, Malaysia (my Dad was from there) were stlll 100V (the Japanese wired much of it for electricity during occupation, but after the war the natives used UK style sockets, both round pin and 13A in random combinations). This caused great consternation when a 100V appliance was taken to Kuala Lumpur and connected to 230V (usually resulting in bangs/smoke and shouts of "aiyaaa!")
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Old 7th Aug 2013, 2:26 pm   #3
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Default Re: Where was the mains voltage 140 Volts AC ?

140/145 volts must have been used somewhere ! but was never a common voltage.

The most likely derivation would have been a 3 phase, 4 wire supply with 240 or 250 volts between phases which would give about 140 to 145 volts phase to neutral.
It would have been usuall though to use 240 volt appliances on such a system.

Broadly similar systems at a slightly lower voltage are still common today.
Parts of the Middle East and South America use 3 phase 4 wire at 127/220 volts.

240 volts was a very popular voltage, but was normally either single phase or was derived from a 3 phase, 3 wire system at 240/415 volts.


I have seen 140/145 volt DC supplies, but in that case the 140/145 volts was the MAXIMUM not the nominal voltage.
Normally a 116 or 120 volt nominal lead acid battery charged by an engine driven dynamo. Lighting circuits would be supplied by a voltage regulator so as to give a roughly constant 115 volts on the lamps.
Power circuits direct from the battery and therefore up to about 140/145 volts when the engine was running.
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Old 7th Aug 2013, 2:41 pm   #4
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Default Re: Where was the mains voltage 140 Volts AC ?

My question was partially inspired by the thumbnail pictures in this current thread:

https://www.vintage-radio.net/forum/...ad.php?t=98409

In addition I can definitely remember a Grundig TK35 valve tape-recorder having such a voltage tapping option - clearly for AC use only.

As for UK conversion to 240 V from 200 V, you can add Cambridge and Blackpool. The old Cavendish Laboratory in Cambridge used to have auto transformers for equipment that was 200 V only. BTW: In the very early days Cambridge, always AC, used a frequency of 80 c/s.
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Old 7th Aug 2013, 5:04 pm   #5
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Default Re: Where was the mains voltage 140 Volts AC ?

I can't throw any light on when or where 140VAC supplies were used, but 100 years ago, as GEC used to supply lamps for this sort of voltage.

In the GEC catalogue for 1911-12, while the most common voltage ranges for which lamps were supplied were 100-130V and 200 - 260V, certain types were available at pretty well any voltage. The customer was asked to specify the required voltage when ordering, hence the voltage ranges mentioned were ranges that were available and did not represent the range of voltages over which a particular type of lamp could be used. A range of 150-155V is specified for one particular type of lamp, suggesting that there was a demand for lamps of this particular type for use with a nominal 150V supply.
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Old 7th Aug 2013, 10:12 pm   #6
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Default Re: Where was the mains voltage 140 Volts AC ?

My grandmother had an early 1930's 6m diathermy set whose mains lead terminated in seperate L and N line sockets. The mains transformer primary taps terminated in recessed panel plugs at the rear, as well as 200-250V tappings, there was a 150V setting. I took this as a sign that 150V AC supplies were at least acknowledged somewhere in Britain- could this have been a hospital generation standard, say?
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Old 7th Aug 2013, 11:05 pm   #7
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Default Re: Where was the mains voltage 140 Volts AC ?

I remember reading somewhere that parts of a South American country (can't recall which one) used 150v at 60hz with US style sockets & plugs. Apparently they used mostly 120v stuff & put up with hot running & short lives..
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Old 8th Aug 2013, 8:16 am   #8
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Default Re: Where was the mains voltage 140 Volts AC ?

These may help, from 1934 voltages in uk.
There are 12 pages alltogether but tried to zip them but no joy, so I will send them in three lots if I can.Gezza
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Old 8th Aug 2013, 8:18 am   #9
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Default Re: Where was the mains voltage 140 Volts AC ?

lot 2
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Old 8th Aug 2013, 8:20 am   #10
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Default Re: Where was the mains voltage 140 Volts AC ?

lot 3
last off the lot hope they help as the book is getting a bit ragged. Gezza
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Old 8th Aug 2013, 9:57 am   #11
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Default Re: Where was the mains voltage 140 Volts AC ?

If parts of the Continent were wired as 127 V phase-neutral and 220 V phase-phase, and the 140 volt setting was only seen on imported equipment, is it possible that manufacturers there provided this option because they (falsely) assumed that the UK would have been wired as 140 / 240 V, as opposed to the actual 240 / 415 V ?
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Old 8th Aug 2013, 10:34 am   #12
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Default Re: Where was the mains voltage 140 Volts AC ?

Thanks for these. Presumably A = AC and C = DC? From a quick scan the closest to 140V are the 150V supplies for Leyton and Leytonstone, but these were apparently DC alternatives to 230VAC.

I am intrigued by the 400, 440 and 450V AC supplies for Foulridge (P118), Lochaber (P121); Norton (P122); Tanfield, Tantobie and Trawden (P125), as the sole supplies for these places.
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Old 8th Aug 2013, 12:37 pm   #13
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Default Re: Where was the mains voltage 140 Volts AC ?

I'm intrigued that the list has so many small places, but Worcester (Worcs) is missing. There was definitely a power station there in 1936! Though it wasn't the "Queen Mary" (local term for the three funnelled power house built in 1942) that I remember. We ran on 200Vac until the late '50s or early '60s- I remember the "conversion" during which anything without an adjustable tapping was basically left to get on with it!
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Old 8th Aug 2013, 1:19 pm   #14
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Default Re: Where was the mains voltage 140 Volts AC ?

I couldn't find Ipswich or Norwich either. So I looked under my district in Ipswich which is Rushmere and there it was. Haven't found Norwich yet though.
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Old 8th Aug 2013, 2:57 pm   #15
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Default Re: Where was the mains voltage 140 Volts AC ?

No Norwich, but I did notice Costessey there. I guess cities that were less unified would be listed under their individual suburbs.
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Old 8th Aug 2013, 4:47 pm   #16
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Default Re: Where was the mains voltage 140 Volts AC ?

Or maybe different parts of some cities were supplied by different electric companies, and so had to be listed separately by district, because different parts of Norwich, for example, might have had different supplies.
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Old 8th Aug 2013, 6:13 pm   #17
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Default Re: Where was the mains voltage 140 Volts AC ?

There's an entry for "Langley (Norwich)". The mention of Norwich is probably just to show which village of Langley is being referred to. The original power station in Norwich was in Duke Street. A new one was later built at Thorpe and retained it's WW2 camouflage for decades.
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Old 8th Aug 2013, 7:20 pm   #18
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Default Re: Where was the mains voltage 140 Volts AC ?

Hi Gents, Tantobie and Tanfield are up here in my neck of the woods; these would probably be colliery supplies, not from the main grid, which was pretty well advanced in the NE at that time.

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Old 8th Aug 2013, 10:32 pm   #19
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Default Re: Where was the mains voltage 140 Volts AC ?

Thanks for the Tantobie and Tanfield info.

I see there are individual entries for West Ham and Cannning Town (in East London). Canning Town was a part of West Ham and as far as I know, supplied from the same municipal power station, so I am puzzled that it should have its own entry, as the voltages were identical.

Another omission is Lynmouth, 100V at 100Hz, which, until its power station was destroyed in the floods of 1952, had the last remaining public 100Hz supply.
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Old 8th Aug 2013, 11:59 pm   #20
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Default Re: Where was the mains voltage 140 Volts AC ?

I may be going bog-eyed, but the Huddersfield entry says 316A and when you allow for the fact that the Yorkshire Volt is bigger than the southern one...

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