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Other Vintage Household Electrical or Electromechanical Items For discussions about other vintage (over 25 years old) electrical and electromechanical household items. See the sticky thread for details. |
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29th Oct 2022, 10:40 pm | #1 |
Octode
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Stockport, Cheshire, UK.
Posts: 1,999
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Brittle Light Fittings
Today I was helping my Sister in law sort out a house she's going to rent out.
While attempting to unscrew the skirt of a light fitting to fit a shade the bakelite crumbled in my hand! I guess years of heat had weakened it. I can see replacements are available, as one was missing from another fitting. Also of note was a Nettle cooker switch which is probably original to the house, mid to late 1960s by my estimation.
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29th Oct 2022, 10:46 pm | #2 |
Dekatron
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Oxford, UK.
Posts: 17,820
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Re: Brittle Light Fittings
I'd just replace the whole BC holder. I'm not convinced the skirts are necessarily interchangeable.
Note that with a modern, LED lamp, the heat generated is considerably less than with a traditional GLS one, so the new one is unlikely to go brittle quickly. |
30th Oct 2022, 8:50 am | #3 |
Dekatron
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Warnham, West Sussex. 10 miles south of DORKING.
Posts: 9,145
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Re: Brittle Light Fittings
Yes replace the complete holder. It is now necessary to have a full electrical inspection and certificate before letting property to bring the electrical installation up to date. John.
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30th Oct 2022, 11:42 am | #4 |
Moderator
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Oxford, UK
Posts: 27,783
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Re: Brittle Light Fittings
This sort of deterioration is normal for lampholders that see a lot of use over many years.
I think the shade ring dimensions and thread are standard for BC fittings, but as said you might as well replace the whole thing, especially in a rental property. Landlords have to tick an awful lot of boxes nowadays - the Rigsby days are long gone. The dimensions of ES fittings are different of course. |
30th Oct 2022, 12:28 pm | #5 |
Dekatron
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Worksop, Nottinghamshire, UK.
Posts: 5,549
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Re: Brittle Light Fittings
I have a vintage light fitting with rings that were either brittle or missing when I moved in.
I found that they are the same thread as the nut on a brass 22mm compression fitting. You get two per nut and you need a sharp hacksaw and time. If you are renting the property things have now got so strict that many landlords are pulling out. It would need to be a new fitting from a reputable electrical wholesaler as opposed to a DIY shed. |
30th Oct 2022, 12:50 pm | #6 |
Heptode
Join Date: Sep 2018
Location: Twickenham, London, UK.
Posts: 536
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Re: Brittle Light Fittings
I had the BC bulb holder in my Anglepoise lamp disintegrate as a result of heat from when it had filament bulbs in it.
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30th Oct 2022, 12:54 pm | #7 |
Octode
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Stockport, Cheshire, UK.
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Re: Brittle Light Fittings
OK I'll let my sister in law know.
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30th Oct 2022, 3:05 pm | #8 |
Dekatron
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Brentwood, Essex, UK.
Posts: 5,316
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Re: Brittle Light Fittings
The heating efficiency certificate rules, and the way they are interpreted, can result in absurdities. A few months ago a caller to the BBC's "You and Yours" related how, following government exhortations to go green, she had replaced her gas boiler with an electric heat pump, and had been rewarded by having her energy efficiency rating downgraded. It seems that energy efficiency is not detetermined by the thermal efficiency of the heating system, but by how much it costs to run, and the higher cost of electricity negated the higher thermal efficiency of the heat pump.
I think the standard BC shade ring thread uses the standard brass thread pitch of 26tpi. Last edited by emeritus; 30th Oct 2022 at 3:11 pm. Reason: typos |
30th Oct 2022, 4:36 pm | #9 |
Dekatron
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Wiltshire, UK.
Posts: 13,951
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Re: Brittle Light Fittings
If the shade ring has crumbled then I bet the rest of the fitting is in a bad way too. And the drop flex should receive a detailed scrutiny for any sign that the PVC insulation has gone hard or brittle.
My local electrical place sells MK bulbholders pre wired to a drop flex for less than the cost of the holder alone. While you have the ladder out, it makes sense to replace the lot to reduce the risk of it failing and having to call an emergency electrician out because your tenant is in darkness.
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30th Oct 2022, 5:58 pm | #10 |
Dekatron
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Oxford, UK.
Posts: 17,820
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Re: Brittle Light Fittings
Well said. It will look nicer than a yellowed 50 year-old example too.
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30th Oct 2022, 7:04 pm | #11 | |
Hexode
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Manchester, UK.
Posts: 478
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Re: Brittle Light Fittings
Quote:
I nicked it and replaced the holder which is readily available from the anglepoise website..
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30th Oct 2022, 8:01 pm | #12 |
Nonode
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Coulsdon, London, UK.
Posts: 2,152
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Re: Brittle Light Fittings
When I buy a replacement pendant bulb-holder I make sure it is T2 rated.
They are made from heat resistant materials. |
30th Oct 2022, 9:30 pm | #13 |
Nonode
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Stafford, Staffs. UK.
Posts: 2,529
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Re: Brittle Light Fittings
I've been across BC fittings damaged from incandescent lamp heat for a long time. Even had a relative who wouldn't let me replace the lamp holder which resulted in the lamp dropping out of the holder. The lamp didn't smash, but they were somewhat surprised when the lamp was put back in and immediately failed.
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5th Nov 2022, 12:57 pm | #14 |
Octode
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Wrexham, North Wales, UK.
Posts: 1,457
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Re: Brittle Light Fittings
My late Grandfather's house was bought in 1970 and was sold in 2009, the upstairs pendants needed replacing to satisfy the estate agent, 4 new complete pendants replaced the old twisted pair single insulated fixtures but then we had a problem with the dining room pendant, it's 100W bulb destroyed the wiring, it was bodged with any bulb holder available and left at that.
The morale of this story is simple, 39 years of 100W bulbs ain't good for anything.
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5th Nov 2022, 8:39 pm | #15 |
Dekatron
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Brentwood, Essex, UK.
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Re: Brittle Light Fittings
I think the trouble with hot 100W bulbs stems from the progressive reduction in bulb size, meaning that the lamps had progressively smaller surface areas from which to dissipate heat by convection. In the 1950's, my recollection is that the glass bulbs of 100W bulbs were larger than those of the lower-wattage ones, confirmed by a 1960's book on illumination that reproduces a table of bulb sizes from the then-current BSI spec. By the 1970's the 100W was the same size as the 60W, and by the 2000's Tesco for one was selling 100W bulbs not much bigger than golf ball bulbs, proclaiming their environmental advantage of using less glass. The boxes of similar-sized ones made by GE that I got from Screwfix shortly before their sale was banned, indicated that they were intended for base-down burning. So perhaps it is not surprising that later generations of the more compact 100W bulbs have been cooking the lampholders that were fine with the original type of bulb.
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5th Nov 2022, 10:46 pm | #16 |
Nonode
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Stafford, Staffs. UK.
Posts: 2,529
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Re: Brittle Light Fittings
I've seen it with 60W bulbs to be fair, and with standard sizes. I think lampshades with reduced airflow also play a part. But the biggest factor seems to be hours. It was always in rooms where the light was on for a significant time.
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6th Nov 2022, 1:56 am | #17 |
Dekatron
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Brentwood, Essex, UK.
Posts: 5,316
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Re: Brittle Light Fittings
I guess another factor is that, whereas the old Bakelite pendant fittings had shade rings of comparable dimensions to the brass rings used on brass BC lampholders, all the more recent pendant lamp holders I have seen have come with a skirt that completely surrounds the bayonet socket when assembled. These skirts must reduce the ability of lampholders to dissipate heat.
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6th Nov 2022, 9:43 am | #18 |
Dekatron
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Warnham, West Sussex. 10 miles south of DORKING.
Posts: 9,145
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Re: Brittle Light Fittings
I think we may be getting too deep. It's only a lampholder!
We all know that heat travels upwards and back in the day when we used metal filament lamps the holder did need occasional replacement especially if using 150W lamps which a number of my customers used in the living room. I always fitted the best quality holders to avoid the inevitable complaint of a rotting fish smell! Most traditional lamps are now virtually unobtainable and of course the LED replacements run practically warm so the problem has faded away. John. |
19th Nov 2022, 8:16 pm | #19 |
Heptode
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Leeds, West Yorkshire, UK.
Posts: 899
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Re: Brittle Light Fittings
back in the 60s my gran had a 5 lamp light fitting in the lounge each with a 100 watt bulb fitted .You needed sunglasses before switch on not to mention the heat and the electric bill . When asking why so bright she would say [so i can see to knit]
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20th Nov 2022, 12:07 am | #20 |
Dekatron
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Leominster, Herefordshire, UK.
Posts: 16,526
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Re: Brittle Light Fittings
There's the option of brass/ceramic bulb holders, but you'd then need heat resistant drop leads and nowadays an earth as well
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