Floppy disk controller card - UK Vintage Radio Repair and Restoration Discussion Forum

TALKINGWITHPYE · 3rd Feb 2021, 3:57 pm

Hello all, I have an old 486 machine whose floppy controller has packed up. It also provides 2 com ports on an additional bracket, The 9 pin port works with the mouse but the floppy drive can't be read. When I try to transefer from the c drive to the a drive I get drive not ready Abort Retry Fail. There is no makers name on the card which is of the ISA type. I use the machine to program ex pmr radios and I occasionally need to transfer files to a floppy to send in the post.

wireless_john · 3rd Feb 2021, 4:54 pm

Definitely not the drive itself or the floppy disk?

SiriusHardware · 3rd Feb 2021, 5:17 pm

Agree, I would look for physical problems on the drive - snapped drive belt (if it has one) or dirty heads possibly. I would try another floppy drive first, if available. I'm assuming you have already tried several different discs.

I have several 3.5"" 1.4MB drives with beige fronts here, believed working, if you can't find one anywhere else. I'm assuming your drive is not a 5.25" drive?

TALKINGWITHPYE · 4th Feb 2021, 9:48 am

Thanks for your replies, I tried the drive in another computer and it worked so I concluded that the controller card has failed, the light on the drive comes on but the motor doesn't appear to spin so I reckon the drive is not getting the motor spin command. I have looked on ebay for a replacement card but there are so many I could buy one and find it doesn't suit.I will ask locally among local radio amateurs if anyone has either a card or a scrap computer I could raid for spares. I tried to upload a picture of my board but I couldn't get it to attach to the posting.

Thanks again
Dave GI8LCJ

Dave Moll · 4th Feb 2021, 10:01 am

What interface (ISA/PCI etc.) does your controller card use?

Yes, an image would help. Did you remember to click "upload" when attaching?

cheerfulcharlie · 4th Feb 2021, 10:55 am

Have you checked in the bios?

A lot of older computers have an A and B drive option so you may be able to switch it to the B drive? which you can set up in the starting order of the computer.

ie.

A or B first or second in starting first.. or C (hard drive) first then A or B etc

SiriusHardware · 4th Feb 2021, 11:07 am

Remembering Philips software of old, I would not be surprised if it is hard-coded to run from drive A:.

I would still at least look into the drive to see if it uses a belt, and if that is OK. I know you say the motor is not going, but it might be fairly quiet.

TALKINGWITHPYE · 4th Feb 2021, 11:09 am

The card uses an ISA interface slot. As in the picture, originally I couldn't see the upload button as the upload from computer window was not expanded.

Dave Moll · 4th Feb 2021, 11:21 am

Quote:

Originally Posted by SiriusHardware

I would still at least look into the drive to see if it uses a belt, and if that is OK. I know you say the motor is not going, but it might be fairly quiet.

Don't forget that the drive has been shown to work in a different computer, so the problem is presumably either with the controller or its connection to the drive rather than the drive itself.

TALKINGWITHPYE · 4th Feb 2021, 11:28 am

Another attempt to get picture onto the posting.

SiriusHardware · 4th Feb 2021, 11:36 am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave Moll

...the problem is presumably either with the controller or its connection to the drive rather than the drive itself.

Apologies, I missed that in #4.

A 'Multi I/O card!' Now there's a term I've not heard in...

Dave Moll · 4th Feb 2021, 1:19 pm

Snap!

Look what I've found lurking among my boxes of bits - its exact twin. If you would like it, PM me with your address and it's yours for the cost of postage.

Dave Moll · 5th Feb 2021, 10:27 am

The twin is on its way to TWT. Let's hope this fixes the problem.

TALKINGWITHPYE · 16th Feb 2021, 12:08 pm

More info on my floppy drive problem. When I boot up from the c drive and then try to change to the A drive by typing A: Enter. I get general failure reading drive a. I can hear the drive mechanics in action but the A prompt does not appear. The controller card must be sending the power to the stepper motor and the disk spin motor but it appears that the processor is not getting the disk select information. Anyone had this before?

Dave

Slothie · 16th Feb 2021, 9:15 pm

It might be worth getting some isopropyl (not acetone!) and cleaning the heads, slide rails and any drive screws that move the head. Lightly lubricate with light oil (3-in-1, sewing machine oil or best of all white lithium grease) as If they are sticky or bind they can appear to move but not be able to get aligned with the tracks. Often with old floppies the lubricant can go hard and crusty as the volotile elements evaporate and dust sticks to what is left. look for dust, hair etc that might be getting trapped too. Look to see if any opto sensors are not obstructed, if the controller cannot get the "track 0" signal when it tries to reset the drive you will get a general failure error too. Dirty heads can cause problems too, though you usually get "bad sector" errors.

Dave Moll · 16th Feb 2021, 10:12 pm

But hasn't it been estalished that the drive works in a different computer? (See post no. 4.)

Slothie · 16th Feb 2021, 10:33 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave Moll

But hasn't it been estalished that the drive works in a different computer? (See post no. 4.)

Ah. Yes. Ignore that

TALKINGWITHPYE · 18th Feb 2021, 11:47 am

Hi all, when looking for the CMOS battery on the motherboard I was surprised to find that there wasn't one. I did find a real time clock module and the BIOS chip. Has anyone come across such a setup and can understand why no backup back up battery.

Dave

cmjones01 · 18th Feb 2021, 11:51 am

There are lots of real time clock modules out there which have a battery built in. They're often made by Dallas semiconductor. Common in some test equipment is the DS1287, but I don't it has a real time clock, just battery-backed RAM.

The batteries fail, of course, which requires replacing the whole module with a new one (if available) or a substitute.

Chris

G6ONEDave · 18th Feb 2021, 11:56 am

Try typing B: in your DOS prompt. It could be that the computer bios is not seeing A: drive. If the B: works then check if the drive has a link for changing it's reference from A to B, not all floppy drives have the link but might be worth checking it, later drives are normally internally set to A link. It could also still be a bios setting, which will need to be checked.
As an after thought you could try swapping the connector socket on the ribbon cable to the floppy, they used to have 3 sockets and had cross over wires to the sockets, so it might simply be that the drive is on the wrong socket.
Dave

3rd Feb 2021, 3:57 pm	#1
TALKINGWITHPYE Pentode Join Date: Oct 2018 Location: Carrickfergus, County Antrim, Northern Ireland, UK. Posts: 126	Floppy disk controller card Hello all, I have an old 486 machine whose floppy controller has packed up. It also provides 2 com ports on an additional bracket, The 9 pin port works with the mouse but the floppy drive can't be read. When I try to transefer from the c drive to the a drive I get drive not ready Abort Retry Fail. There is no makers name on the card which is of the ISA type. I use the machine to program ex pmr radios and I occasionally need to transfer files to a floppy to send in the post.

3rd Feb 2021, 4:54 pm	#2
wireless_john Heptode Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: Gosport, Hampshire, UK. Posts: 605	Re: Floppy disk controlled card Definitely not the drive itself or the floppy disk? __________________ GQRP Club 4704 - BVWS Member

3rd Feb 2021, 5:17 pm	#3
SiriusHardware Dekatron Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Newcastle, Tyne and Wear, UK. Posts: 11,553	Re: Floppy disk controlled card Agree, I would look for physical problems on the drive - snapped drive belt (if it has one) or dirty heads possibly. I would try another floppy drive first, if available. I'm assuming you have already tried several different discs. I have several 3.5"" 1.4MB drives with beige fronts here, believed working, if you can't find one anywhere else. I'm assuming your drive is not a 5.25" drive?

4th Feb 2021, 10:01 am	#5
Dave Moll Dekatron Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: West Cumbria (CA13), UK Posts: 6,127	Re: Floppy disk controlled card What interface (ISA/PCI etc.) does your controller card use? Yes, an image would help. Did you remember to click "upload" when attaching? __________________ Mending is better than Ending (cf Brave New World by Aldous Huxley)

4th Feb 2021, 10:55 am	#6
cheerfulcharlie Heptode Join Date: May 2009 Location: Birmingham, West Midlands, UK. Posts: 708	Re: Floppy disk controlled card Have you checked in the bios? A lot of older computers have an A and B drive option so you may be able to switch it to the B drive? which you can set up in the starting order of the computer. ie. A or B first or second in starting first.. or C (hard drive) first then A or B etc

4th Feb 2021, 9:48 am	#4
TALKINGWITHPYE Pentode Join Date: Oct 2018 Location: Carrickfergus, County Antrim, Northern Ireland, UK. Posts: 126	Re: Floppy disk controlled card Thanks for your replies, I tried the drive in another computer and it worked so I concluded that the controller card has failed, the light on the drive comes on but the motor doesn't appear to spin so I reckon the drive is not getting the motor spin command. I have looked on ebay for a replacement card but there are so many I could buy one and find it doesn't suit.I will ask locally among local radio amateurs if anyone has either a card or a scrap computer I could raid for spares. I tried to upload a picture of my board but I couldn't get it to attach to the posting. Thanks again Dave GI8LCJ

4th Feb 2021, 11:07 am	#7
SiriusHardware Dekatron Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Newcastle, Tyne and Wear, UK. Posts: 11,553	Re: Floppy disk controlled card Remembering Philips software of old, I would not be surprised if it is hard-coded to run from drive A:. I would still at least look into the drive to see if it uses a belt, and if that is OK. I know you say the motor is not going, but it might be fairly quiet.

4th Feb 2021, 11:09 am	#8
TALKINGWITHPYE Pentode Join Date: Oct 2018 Location: Carrickfergus, County Antrim, Northern Ireland, UK. Posts: 126	Re: Floppy disk controlled card The card uses an ISA interface slot. As in the picture, originally I couldn't see the upload button as the upload from computer window was not expanded.

4th Feb 2021, 11:28 am	#10
TALKINGWITHPYE Pentode Join Date: Oct 2018 Location: Carrickfergus, County Antrim, Northern Ireland, UK. Posts: 126	Re: Floppy disk controlled card Another attempt to get picture onto the posting. Attached Thumbnails

4th Feb 2021, 1:19 pm	#12
Dave Moll Dekatron Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: West Cumbria (CA13), UK Posts: 6,127	Re: Floppy disk controlled card Snap! Look what I've found lurking among my boxes of bits - its exact twin. If you would like it, PM me with your address and it's yours for the cost of postage. Attached Thumbnails __________________ Mending is better than Ending (cf Brave New World by Aldous Huxley)

5th Feb 2021, 10:27 am	#13
Dave Moll Dekatron Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: West Cumbria (CA13), UK Posts: 6,127	Re: Floppy disk controller card The twin is on its way to TWT. Let's hope this fixes the problem. __________________ Mending is better than Ending (cf Brave New World by Aldous Huxley)

16th Feb 2021, 12:08 pm	#14
TALKINGWITHPYE Pentode Join Date: Oct 2018 Location: Carrickfergus, County Antrim, Northern Ireland, UK. Posts: 126	Re: Floppy disk controller card More info on my floppy drive problem. When I boot up from the c drive and then try to change to the A drive by typing A: Enter. I get general failure reading drive a. I can hear the drive mechanics in action but the A prompt does not appear. The controller card must be sending the power to the stepper motor and the disk spin motor but it appears that the processor is not getting the disk select information. Anyone had this before? Dave

16th Feb 2021, 9:15 pm	#15
Slothie Octode Join Date: Apr 2018 Location: Newbury, Berkshire, UK. Posts: 1,287	Re: Floppy disk controller card It might be worth getting some isopropyl (not acetone!) and cleaning the heads, slide rails and any drive screws that move the head. Lightly lubricate with light oil (3-in-1, sewing machine oil or best of all white lithium grease) as If they are sticky or bind they can appear to move but not be able to get aligned with the tracks. Often with old floppies the lubricant can go hard and crusty as the volotile elements evaporate and dust sticks to what is left. look for dust, hair etc that might be getting trapped too. Look to see if any opto sensors are not obstructed, if the controller cannot get the "track 0" signal when it tries to reset the drive you will get a general failure error too. Dirty heads can cause problems too, though you usually get "bad sector" errors.

16th Feb 2021, 10:12 pm	#16
Dave Moll Dekatron Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: West Cumbria (CA13), UK Posts: 6,127	Re: Floppy disk controller card But hasn't it been estalished that the drive works in a different computer? (See post no. 4.) __________________ Mending is better than Ending (cf Brave New World by Aldous Huxley)

18th Feb 2021, 11:47 am	#18
TALKINGWITHPYE Pentode Join Date: Oct 2018 Location: Carrickfergus, County Antrim, Northern Ireland, UK. Posts: 126	Re: Floppy disk controller card Hi all, when looking for the CMOS battery on the motherboard I was surprised to find that there wasn't one. I did find a real time clock module and the BIOS chip. Has anyone come across such a setup and can understand why no backup back up battery. Dave

18th Feb 2021, 11:51 am	#19
cmjones01 Nonode Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Warsaw, Poland and Cambridge, UK Posts: 2,677	Re: Floppy disk controller card There are lots of real time clock modules out there which have a battery built in. They're often made by Dallas semiconductor. Common in some test equipment is the DS1287, but I don't it has a real time clock, just battery-backed RAM. The batteries fail, of course, which requires replacing the whole module with a new one (if available) or a substitute. Chris __________________ What's going on in the workshop? http://martin-jones.com/

18th Feb 2021, 11:56 am	#20
G6ONEDave Octode Join Date: Dec 2019 Location: Owston Ferry, North Lincolnshire, UK. Posts: 1,701	Re: Floppy disk controller card Try typing B: in your DOS prompt. It could be that the computer bios is not seeing A: drive. If the B: works then check if the drive has a link for changing it's reference from A to B, not all floppy drives have the link but might be worth checking it, later drives are normally internally set to A link. It could also still be a bios setting, which will need to be checked. As an after thought you could try swapping the connector socket on the ribbon cable to the floppy, they used to have 3 sockets and had cross over wires to the sockets, so it might simply be that the drive is on the wrong socket. Dave