Philips 21TG100U You better believe it! - UK Vintage Radio Repair and Restoration Discussion Forum

Heatercathodeshort · 12th Jun 2007, 9:15 pm

My earlier thread mentioned a Philips 21TG100U receiver from 1959/60. You can believe this or not but here goes. This chassis also opens up in a similar fashion the the Thorn 1500 but is a hand wired job, very well constructed and heavy steel! Removal of the back revealed three valves strangely missing: the PL81 line output, PY81 boost diode and the PCL82 frame output. part frame oscillator.

I fitted these and after connecting the set to the mains the valves lit and after about thirty seconds a bubbling sound followed by a rifle shot and a flash. You guessed it ;the mains buffer cap had died after such an awakening after all these years.
I snipped this off and switched on again. To my amazement the line came up with a brilliant raster on the Mullard AW 53-88 tube. It was short lived and another bubbling sound announced the failure of the .47uf boost capacitor. A replacement was hooked in as you can see by the picture, and after connecting the Aurora a simply brilliant test card appeared on the crt.
Ok, it's not linear, and the digital camera does no justice to the brilliance and contrast of the display but a few capacitors will cure that.

Large screen 405 line sets of this type are very watchable today and the line structure is not a problem. This is going to be a real cracker.

Regards John.

Mikey405 · 12th Jun 2007, 9:43 pm

Hi John.

This is one of my favourite all time sets. They always gave a cracking picture and were lovely things. I don't think they were boring myself - I like the very uncluttered look. There is no "Frame Lin Top" control on these sets (as far as I can see) and despite changing almost everything I could never get mine quite right, although it's not TOO bad.

From Mike.

Mike Phelan · 13th Jun 2007, 9:01 am

Nice job indeed, John. I always liked these from a servicing and reliability point of view - better than its contemporary, the Fergy 506/HMV 1890.
I don't remember LOPTx problems, but they were not too old when I handled them - mainly just the usual valve and tuner problems.

Heatercathodeshort · 13th Jun 2007, 8:01 pm

Lopt failure was rare when these sets were in general use. The scan coils were another story. The frame windings would go O/C resulting in the classic bent frame collapse caused by modulation of the remaining good coil by line interaction. This also happened with the later 19TG122 series using the same potted coils. They were expensive at the time. The work carried out on this set took no more than five minutes! I will finish the job and post a few more pics. Not bad considering it had not been turned on for at least 25 years!
Was it really over forty years? It honestly seems more like ten......Regards John.

plumbweiss · 13th Jun 2007, 10:37 pm

Thats a nice picture Mikey, I like this sort of set as they are very evocative of the post-austerity modernism that developed throughout the 60's.

Steve_P · 14th Jun 2007, 8:59 pm

Frame linearity on these is R427.

This is a pre-set slider mounted below the Contrast Control. It should be set for optimum linearity. There is no separate control for the top linearity. The linearity circuit on these consists of a 2ms integrator (R429,R430,C413) and then a differentiation circuit (C411,C412,R427,R426).

The diagram shows C414 as well, across C413. Try varying this, then check resistors and change caps.

Cheers,

Steve P

flyingtech55 · 15th Jun 2007, 10:15 am

Our first family TV was a Philips 17TG102U. Can't remember what the 'U' stood for.

TimR

Paul Stenning · 15th Jun 2007, 7:59 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by flyingtech55

Can't remember what the 'U' stood for.

"Universal" probably, meaning AC or DC mains.

Panrock · 15th Jun 2007, 8:29 pm

Lovely sets. A classic in my opinion, with a smooth minimalist design - very '1960', showing promise of a bright new age to come.

My Gran had the 17" version of this set. I dropped it down the stairs, so had to repair the broken cabinet and fit a new (Lawson) tube. Shortly afterwards I also had to replace the sync sep anode load resistor. My first TV repair!

Steve

Brian R Pateman · 16th Jun 2007, 5:56 pm

A lovely little set and always one of my favourites.

I remember these as being very easy to service and although I started out with a Pye dealer we saw a few of them in the mid 60s.

When I took over my first shop in the mid 80s there was one tucked away at the back of the storeroom - I wish I'd kept it.

Regards,

Heatercathodeshort · 16th Jun 2007, 6:13 pm

Great feedback! The Croydon built Philips sets were a credit to the company.
The 1768U was one of the finest sets ever built and is sadly neglected today due to its lack of value. [Oh how I hate the 'whats it worth brigade'] It is the previous model to this one. All this interest has shamed me into bringing this set up to standard. Its either the Atkinson service or the Philips 21TG. Both must be tackled..............Thanks again for the interest. John.

12th Jun 2007, 9:15 pm	#1
Heatercathodeshort Dekatron Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Warnham, West Sussex. 10 miles south of DORKING. Posts: 9,147	Philips 21TG100U You better believe it! My earlier thread mentioned a Philips 21TG100U receiver from 1959/60. You can believe this or not but here goes. This chassis also opens up in a similar fashion the the Thorn 1500 but is a hand wired job, very well constructed and heavy steel! Removal of the back revealed three valves strangely missing: the PL81 line output, PY81 boost diode and the PCL82 frame output. part frame oscillator. I fitted these and after connecting the set to the mains the valves lit and after about thirty seconds a bubbling sound followed by a rifle shot and a flash. You guessed it ;the mains buffer cap had died after such an awakening after all these years. I snipped this off and switched on again. To my amazement the line came up with a brilliant raster on the Mullard AW 53-88 tube. It was short lived and another bubbling sound announced the failure of the .47uf boost capacitor. A replacement was hooked in as you can see by the picture, and after connecting the Aurora a simply brilliant test card appeared on the crt. Ok, it's not linear, and the digital camera does no justice to the brilliance and contrast of the display but a few capacitors will cure that. Large screen 405 line sets of this type are very watchable today and the line structure is not a problem. This is going to be a real cracker. Regards John. Attached Thumbnails

12th Jun 2007, 9:43 pm	#2
Mikey405 Octode Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Solihull, West Midlands and Beaford, Devon Posts: 1,626	Re: Philips 21TG100U You better believe it! Hi John. This is one of my favourite all time sets. They always gave a cracking picture and were lovely things. I don't think they were boring myself - I like the very uncluttered look. There is no "Frame Lin Top" control on these sets (as far as I can see) and despite changing almost everything I could never get mine quite right, although it's not TOO bad. From Mike. Attached Thumbnails __________________ G7TRF

13th Jun 2007, 9:01 am	#3
Mike Phelan Dekatron Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Near Leeds, West Yorkshire, UK Posts: 4,609	Re: Philips 21TG100U You better believe it! Nice job indeed, John. I always liked these from a servicing and reliability point of view - better than its contemporary, the Fergy 506/HMV 1890. I don't remember LOPTx problems, but they were not too old when I handled them - mainly just the usual valve and tuner problems. __________________ Mike.

13th Jun 2007, 8:01 pm	#4
Heatercathodeshort Dekatron Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Warnham, West Sussex. 10 miles south of DORKING. Posts: 9,147	Re: Philips 21TG100U You better believe it! Lopt failure was rare when these sets were in general use. The scan coils were another story. The frame windings would go O/C resulting in the classic bent frame collapse caused by modulation of the remaining good coil by line interaction. This also happened with the later 19TG122 series using the same potted coils. They were expensive at the time. The work carried out on this set took no more than five minutes! I will finish the job and post a few more pics. Not bad considering it had not been turned on for at least 25 years! Was it really over forty years? It honestly seems more like ten......Regards John.

13th Jun 2007, 10:37 pm	#5
plumbweiss Retired Dormant Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Manchester, UK. Posts: 157	Re: Philips 21TG100U You better believe it! Thats a nice picture Mikey, I like this sort of set as they are very evocative of the post-austerity modernism that developed throughout the 60's.

14th Jun 2007, 8:59 pm	#6
Steve_P Dekatron Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Bolton, Greater Manchester, UK. Posts: 6,644	Re: Philips 21TG100U You better believe it! Frame linearity on these is R427. This is a pre-set slider mounted below the Contrast Control. It should be set for optimum linearity. There is no separate control for the top linearity. The linearity circuit on these consists of a 2ms integrator (R429,R430,C413) and then a differentiation circuit (C411,C412,R427,R426). The diagram shows C414 as well, across C413. Try varying this, then check resistors and change caps. Cheers, Steve P __________________ If we've always had it, why is the Car Boot open? You're not sneaking another Old TV in are you...?

15th Jun 2007, 10:15 am	#7
flyingtech55 Octode Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Ayrshire, UK. Posts: 1,096	Re: Philips 21TG100U You better believe it! Our first family TV was a Philips 17TG102U. Can't remember what the 'U' stood for. TimR

15th Jun 2007, 8:29 pm	#9
Panrock Nonode Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Worcestershire, UK. Posts: 2,534	Re: Philips 21TG100U You better believe it! Lovely sets. A classic in my opinion, with a smooth minimalist design - very '1960', showing promise of a bright new age to come. My Gran had the 17" version of this set. I dropped it down the stairs, so had to repair the broken cabinet and fit a new (Lawson) tube. Shortly afterwards I also had to replace the sync sep anode load resistor. My first TV repair! Steve __________________ https://www.radiocraft.co.uk

16th Jun 2007, 5:56 pm	#10
Brian R Pateman Nonode Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Western Lake District, Cumbria (CA20) - UK Posts: 2,136	Re: Philips 21TG100U You better believe it! A lovely little set and always one of my favourites. I remember these as being very easy to service and although I started out with a Pye dealer we saw a few of them in the mid 60s. When I took over my first shop in the mid 80s there was one tucked away at the back of the storeroom - I wish I'd kept it. Regards, __________________ Brian

16th Jun 2007, 6:13 pm	#11
Heatercathodeshort Dekatron Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Warnham, West Sussex. 10 miles south of DORKING. Posts: 9,147	Re: Philips 21TG100U You better believe it! Great feedback! The Croydon built Philips sets were a credit to the company. The 1768U was one of the finest sets ever built and is sadly neglected today due to its lack of value. [Oh how I hate the 'whats it worth brigade'] It is the previous model to this one. All this interest has shamed me into bringing this set up to standard. Its either the Atkinson service or the Philips 21TG. Both must be tackled..............Thanks again for the interest. John.