Anyone remember the HMV 1820? - UK Vintage Radio Repair and Restoration Discussion Forum

Leon Crampin · 10th Nov 2015, 1:29 pm

As a child, we had one of these enormous console sets fitted originally with a 21" Emiscope 4/13 metal cone tube. This was replaced very soon with an MW 53-80 which gave good results.

The set was built on 3 separate chassis, RF/IF unit; power supplies and timebases - complete with a big transformer for the valve heaters, and a wonderful RF EHT unit. This had its own power supply with 2 U107 valves in a doubler and used (I think) a KT36 as a self-oscillating EHT generator. It sat in an enormous screened box with an air-cored sectionally wound transformer, a U37 on top and a waxed board of EHT bleeder resistors.

As a teenager, I did some work on this set and had the circuit. At the back of my mind was the thought that it used a secondary emission valve in the vision IF amplifier. It would have been glass-based - does anyone know if it did, and what it was?

A beast of a set with the option of a wired remote control - good sound from an N37 output valve and big elliptical 'speaker.

Leon.

Peter.N. · 10th Nov 2015, 2:43 pm

Don't think I have ever seen one of those although I remember a big English Electric with a metal cone tube.

Peter

Heatercathodeshort · 10th Nov 2015, 5:35 pm

David Boynes [Fernseh] had one of these a while back. I had the English Electric version as a kid. 21" EE tube T909 metal cone. Nasty! It didn't last long and was replaced with the Mullard MW53-20, still massive but a lot more reliable and all glass of course. I think the model number was C42.
The HMV is massive with an RF EHT unit. Must have cost a fortune. John.

FERNSEH · 10th Nov 2015, 6:33 pm

Hi John,
I did indeed have an HMV 1820, but it was passed on to another collector sometime in the 1990s.
It sure was a massive set, possibly even bigger than the Ferguson 247T which was recently the subject of discussion in this Forum.
The 1820 was possibly the first 21" CRT receiver to be marketed in the UK, that was in 1952. The Emiscope CRT was similar to the the English Electric T909 which also had the 21" round faceplate and metal cone. The EMI tube had a different gun assembly, having the familiar EMI glass seven pin base.
The tube went out of production very quickly and the service department issued the Mullard all glass rectangular MW53-20 as the approved replacement. The new tube dropped straight in without any modifications to the CRT mask.
The 1820 employed a twelve position turret tuner which was loaded with the five Band 1 channels. It's likely this tuner was supplied from America by the EMI affiliate RCA. It used two valves, B309/12AT7 and Z776AM6.
The tuner was positioned at the back of the receiver.
When it came to Band three conversion EMI supplied the companies' own 14 position incremental tuner. This new unit was now fitted at the front of the set in place of the brightness control. A new combined concentric volume and brightness control was also supplied in the conversion kit. The original tuner was then disconnected.
A nice set to have in a collection but you'll plenty space for it.

DFWB.

Nuvistor · 13th Nov 2015, 7:42 pm

Just reading a Practical Television from January 1952, there is a short write up about the 1820 and 1903. The 1903 is a 1820 with a 10 band radio and a gramophone. The write up states the 1903 came as a matching 3 cabinet unit.
Price, inc tax 1820 275 guineas, 1903 540 guineas.

Frank

G6Tanuki · 13th Nov 2015, 8:01 pm

540 guineas was a good year's salary for a typical middle-class UK worker [draughtsman/solicitor/bank-manager] back then.

You would have paid about the same amount for a semi-detached house outside London, or for a Morris Minor to park outside it!

Leon Crampin · 14th Nov 2015, 1:10 pm

Thanks for the various responses. Does anyone have a circuit diagram for the 1820? I don't need it, but I wonder if my recollection of the secondary emission valve in the vision IF strip is correct?

Leon.

FERNSEH · 14th Nov 2015, 4:38 pm

The 1820 employed a secondary emission valve in the vision IF amplifier, a Marconi-Osram type Axxxx. An all glass valve on a B9A base. I'll determine the full type number when the service manual is found.

DFWB.

FERNSEH · 14th Nov 2015, 5:33 pm

The secondary emission valve in the vision IF amplifier was a type E2133. It would appear that the developer was English Electric. The MO equivalent is the Z319.

http://www.radiomuseum.org/tubes/tube_e2133.html

Unlike the earlier Mullard SE valves which were tetrodes the E2133 is a pentode.

Leon Crampin · 14th Nov 2015, 11:17 pm

Thanks very much for finding this information - it's good to know my recollections are correct.

I remember this set as having pretty good gain for its design date - it was used in Grimsby before the Belmont transmitter was built, receiving signals from Holme Moss and Emley Moor at the fringe of their service areas. The EMI incrementally tuned tuner was a bit flaky at times.

I don't recall the secondary emission stage giving trouble - indeed, the whole set ran cool in its enormous cabinet with two massive mains transformers supplying the heater power - so no dropper resistors.

Leon.

10th Nov 2015, 1:29 pm	#1
Leon Crampin Octode Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Surrey, UK. Posts: 1,870	Anyone remember the HMV 1820? As a child, we had one of these enormous console sets fitted originally with a 21" Emiscope 4/13 metal cone tube. This was replaced very soon with an MW 53-80 which gave good results. The set was built on 3 separate chassis, RF/IF unit; power supplies and timebases - complete with a big transformer for the valve heaters, and a wonderful RF EHT unit. This had its own power supply with 2 U107 valves in a doubler and used (I think) a KT36 as a self-oscillating EHT generator. It sat in an enormous screened box with an air-cored sectionally wound transformer, a U37 on top and a waxed board of EHT bleeder resistors. As a teenager, I did some work on this set and had the circuit. At the back of my mind was the thought that it used a secondary emission valve in the vision IF amplifier. It would have been glass-based - does anyone know if it did, and what it was? A beast of a set with the option of a wired remote control - good sound from an N37 output valve and big elliptical 'speaker. Leon.

10th Nov 2015, 2:43 pm	#2
Peter.N. Dekatron Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Charmouth, Dorset, UK. Posts: 3,601	Re: Anyone remember the HMV 1820? Don't think I have ever seen one of those although I remember a big English Electric with a metal cone tube. Peter

10th Nov 2015, 5:35 pm	#3
Heatercathodeshort Dekatron Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Warnham, West Sussex. 10 miles south of DORKING. Posts: 9,147	Re: Anyone remember the HMV 1820? David Boynes [Fernseh] had one of these a while back. I had the English Electric version as a kid. 21" EE tube T909 metal cone. Nasty! It didn't last long and was replaced with the Mullard MW53-20, still massive but a lot more reliable and all glass of course. I think the model number was C42. The HMV is massive with an RF EHT unit. Must have cost a fortune. John.

10th Nov 2015, 6:33 pm	#4
FERNSEH Dekatron Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Gateshead, Tyne and Wear, UK. Posts: 7,444	Re: Anyone remember the HMV 1820? Hi John, I did indeed have an HMV 1820, but it was passed on to another collector sometime in the 1990s. It sure was a massive set, possibly even bigger than the Ferguson 247T which was recently the subject of discussion in this Forum. The 1820 was possibly the first 21" CRT receiver to be marketed in the UK, that was in 1952. The Emiscope CRT was similar to the the English Electric T909 which also had the 21" round faceplate and metal cone. The EMI tube had a different gun assembly, having the familiar EMI glass seven pin base. The tube went out of production very quickly and the service department issued the Mullard all glass rectangular MW53-20 as the approved replacement. The new tube dropped straight in without any modifications to the CRT mask. The 1820 employed a twelve position turret tuner which was loaded with the five Band 1 channels. It's likely this tuner was supplied from America by the EMI affiliate RCA. It used two valves, B309/12AT7 and Z776AM6. The tuner was positioned at the back of the receiver. When it came to Band three conversion EMI supplied the companies' own 14 position incremental tuner. This new unit was now fitted at the front of the set in place of the brightness control. A new combined concentric volume and brightness control was also supplied in the conversion kit. The original tuner was then disconnected. A nice set to have in a collection but you'll plenty space for it. DFWB.

13th Nov 2015, 7:42 pm	#5
Nuvistor Dekatron Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Wigan, Greater Manchester, UK. Posts: 9,433	Re: Anyone remember the HMV 1820? Just reading a Practical Television from January 1952, there is a short write up about the 1820 and 1903. The 1903 is a 1820 with a 10 band radio and a gramophone. The write up states the 1903 came as a matching 3 cabinet unit. Price, inc tax 1820 275 guineas, 1903 540 guineas. Frank

13th Nov 2015, 8:01 pm	#6
G6Tanuki Dekatron Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Wiltshire, UK. Posts: 13,998	Re: Anyone remember the HMV 1820? 540 guineas was a good year's salary for a typical middle-class UK worker [draughtsman/solicitor/bank-manager] back then. You would have paid about the same amount for a semi-detached house outside London, or for a Morris Minor to park outside it!

14th Nov 2015, 1:10 pm	#7
Leon Crampin Octode Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Surrey, UK. Posts: 1,870	Re: Anyone remember the HMV 1820? Thanks for the various responses. Does anyone have a circuit diagram for the 1820? I don't need it, but I wonder if my recollection of the secondary emission valve in the vision IF strip is correct? Leon.

14th Nov 2015, 4:38 pm	#8
FERNSEH Dekatron Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Gateshead, Tyne and Wear, UK. Posts: 7,444	Re: Anyone remember the HMV 1820? The 1820 employed a secondary emission valve in the vision IF amplifier, a Marconi-Osram type Axxxx. An all glass valve on a B9A base. I'll determine the full type number when the service manual is found. DFWB.

14th Nov 2015, 5:33 pm	#9
FERNSEH Dekatron Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Gateshead, Tyne and Wear, UK. Posts: 7,444	Re: Anyone remember the HMV 1820? The secondary emission valve in the vision IF amplifier was a type E2133. It would appear that the developer was English Electric. The MO equivalent is the Z319. http://www.radiomuseum.org/tubes/tube_e2133.html Unlike the earlier Mullard SE valves which were tetrodes the E2133 is a pentode.

14th Nov 2015, 11:17 pm	#10
Leon Crampin Octode Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Surrey, UK. Posts: 1,870	Re: Anyone remember the HMV 1820? Thanks very much for finding this information - it's good to know my recollections are correct. I remember this set as having pretty good gain for its design date - it was used in Grimsby before the Belmont transmitter was built, receiving signals from Holme Moss and Emley Moor at the fringe of their service areas. The EMI incrementally tuned tuner was a bit flaky at times. I don't recall the secondary emission stage giving trouble - indeed, the whole set ran cool in its enormous cabinet with two massive mains transformers supplying the heater power - so no dropper resistors. Leon.