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Vintage Amateur and Military Radio Amateur/military receivers and transmitters, morse, and any other related vintage comms equipment. |
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5th Mar 2021, 11:09 pm | #61 | |
Heptode
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Great Barr, Sandwell, West Midlands, UK.
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Re: OFCOM re: International Commission on Non-Ionizing Radiation Protection (ICNIRP)
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I think with a mobile phone at 1800MHz the ear will be in the near-field of the antenna, presuming it's near the earpiece, and the power level / duty cycle then becomes irrelevant at very low power levels on the spreadsheet. I calculated 2.6cm as the minimum 'safe' distance. Martin |
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5th Mar 2021, 11:14 pm | #62 |
Nonode
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Worcestershire, UK.
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Re: OFCOM re: International Commission on Non-Ionizing Radiation Protection (ICNIRP)
Thanks. What about diathermy machines where such exposure is intentional?
Steve
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5th Mar 2021, 11:36 pm | #63 | |
Dekatron
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Location: Penrith, Cumbria, UK.
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Re: OFCOM re: International Commission on Non-Ionizing Radiation Protection (ICNIRP)
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Diathermy machines, like MRI scanners, are operated under strictly controlled conditions by trained personnel. Rest assured the operators of such-like will be EMF-aware. I once was working on some control wiring in a high power VLF near field, and when I touched the conductors, I got a not-unpleasant warm tingle right up my arms!
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6th Mar 2021, 9:32 am | #64 | |
Dekatron
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Location: Penrith, Cumbria, UK.
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Re: OFCOM re: International Commission on Non-Ionizing Radiation Protection (ICNIRP)
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I would say they were acting pessimisticly on the best advice available at the time. They would have to ensure there would be absolutely NO risk whatsoever to the user (general public, again) of the mic equipment. Remember that the guidance and legislation by NRPB, later ICNIRP and also CEMFAW, CENELEC, etc... is subject to continuous ongoing review.
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6th Mar 2021, 10:16 am | #65 |
Nonode
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Dukinfield, Cheshire, UK.
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Re: OFCOM re: International Commission on Non-Ionizing Radiation Protection (ICNIRP)
Just to let out the 'old groaner' hiding in me:
This is one of those ridiculous rules that shouldn't be necessary for 99% of Amateurs but we all have to prat about doing it anyway. I'm a dedicated Amateur who has been into radio since I could speak, but this kind of carp really does my head in. It may nudge me to give up and become a full-time listener, which is more or less what I've become over recent years anyway. {bnghd} I hope there's a box to tick that says 'I've never used more than 30W on any band and I have no intention of doing so'. That'd be job done for me. BTW, where does this leave the mobile phone? Everyone and his dog has one and they seem quite content to press the thing against their head, and how often do we pass in close proximity to someone who is using their phone? What about the police and their handhelds?
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6th Mar 2021, 4:20 pm | #66 |
Dekatron
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Location: Kilmarnock, Ayrshire, UK.
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Re: OFCOM re: International Commission on Non-Ionizing Radiation Protection (ICNIRP)
Hi.
As a new amateur I found the calculator rather lacking and confusing. I use a Silm Jim and a 5 Ele Yagi for 2 meters and as yet have to decide what route of antenna to get onto HF. Taking into account feeder losses and antenna gain the calculator came back with distances less than two meters. The antennas are high enough up and no where near where anyone can go, see the photo. I'm hoping to pass the intermediate soon but I'm really wondering if I'll go above 10w PEP.
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7th Mar 2021, 1:47 am | #67 | |
Tetrode
Join Date: May 2020
Location: Lincoln, Lincolnshire, UK.
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Re: OFCOM re: International Commission on Non-Ionizing Radiation Protection (ICNIRP)
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7th Mar 2021, 2:27 pm | #68 |
Nonode
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Dukinfield, Cheshire, UK.
Posts: 2,034
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Re: OFCOM re: International Commission on Non-Ionizing Radiation Protection (ICNIRP)
Call me a conspiracy nut if you want, but I'm beginning to think Ofcom wants to get rid of the amateur bands completely so they can gobble up more spectrum to flog to the Telcom industry. Sticking onerous and confusing regs on us will drive plenty out of the hobby completely. When we are down to a rump of barely active moaners they will petition government to withdraw the allocations. We were severely reduced in our standing when we no longer had to pay for our licence, now this.
I'd better get me pills.
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7th Mar 2021, 2:33 pm | #69 |
Heptode
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Preston, Lancashire, UK.
Posts: 632
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Re: OFCOM re: International Commission on Non-Ionizing Radiation Protection (ICNIRP)
I've got locked gates on the drive and if a “member of the public” were to be able to trespass onto my property and into the garage, and ignore this warning, then they would have more to worry about than RF radiation. Will do the sums though.
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7th Mar 2021, 2:38 pm | #70 | |
Nonode
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Nuneaton, Warwickshire, UK.
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Re: OFCOM re: International Commission on Non-Ionizing Radiation Protection (ICNIRP)
Quote:
Aub G4KQL
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7th Mar 2021, 2:53 pm | #71 |
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Re: OFCOM re: International Commission on Non-Ionizing Radiation Protection (ICNIRP)
Now that keeping a log book hasn't been a requirement for many years, who is to prove that you did transmit at all. Anyway I am going to use the hopeless spreadsheet and use below 10W (I only use 5W maximum on the few times I do transmit anyway), print it out and if (highly unlikely) someone comes round, that is what they will get.
Hang on a minute my handhelds put out 5W too so I should be 4.7m away when using, if I shout that loud I won't need the handheld. |
7th Mar 2021, 2:59 pm | #72 |
Moderator
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Location: Ipswich, Suffolk, IP4, UK.
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Re: OFCOM re: International Commission on Non-Ionizing Radiation Protection (ICNIRP)
I'm just wondering how much EMF my dummy load/wattmeter produces with 50W shoved into it?
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Graham. Forum Moderator Reach for your meter before you reach for your soldering iron. |
7th Mar 2021, 3:06 pm | #73 | |
Nonode
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Location: Worcestershire, UK.
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Re: OFCOM re: International Commission on Non-Ionizing Radiation Protection (ICNIRP)
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Steve
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7th Mar 2021, 3:14 pm | #74 |
Guest
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Re: OFCOM re: International Commission on Non-Ionizing Radiation Protection (ICNIRP)
Adding to my somewhat frivolous post earlier I have read the Ofcom document and found the attached, less than 10W for authorised equipment, as far as I can tell it is yours truly that is authorised to transmit up to 400W regardless of kit. Does this mean I have to do the analysis of a sub 10W transmitter?
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7th Mar 2021, 3:55 pm | #75 |
Octode
Join Date: Dec 2019
Location: Owston Ferry, North Lincolnshire, UK.
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Re: OFCOM re: International Commission on Non-Ionizing Radiation Protection (ICNIRP)
When does the letter arrive notifying all those radio amateurs who are not RSGB members or members of any local clubs? Is this going to be an 'ignorance is no defence in law' situation, when that unexpected knock at the door occurs? The only reason I now know about this latest Ofcom news is through being a forum member and following this thread. I do not currently belong to any radio amateur club, nor am I a member of the RSGB.
Dave
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7th Mar 2021, 3:56 pm | #76 | |
Octode
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: West Midlands, UK.
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Re: OFCOM re: International Commission on Non-Ionizing Radiation Protection (ICNIRP)
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The golden days of amateur radio – though these are different periods for different enthusiasts – are all long gone. The irony of the current situation is that amateur radio equipment has become a consumer item. Plug and play and away you go. CB with a few more bands. No more lash-ups lying around the shack, exposed aerial matching units, etc., not to mention the lethal voltages. Goodness knows what damage I’ve done to myself with full legal limit in the shack – or my parents who both lived to a ripe old age. And now I get to thinking about the number of times I’ve driven through Wychbold, ogling those enormous Radio 4 masts when doing so. As we move towards a zero-risk society, enjoy what is left of this hobby (and some others in a similar vein), until restoring your humble vintage broadcast receiver becomes a job that can only be undertaken by those with professional qualifications. In a hundred years everyone will have the same hobby: staying (at) home watching the telly/screen. |
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7th Mar 2021, 4:19 pm | #77 | |
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Re: OFCOM re: International Commission on Non-Ionizing Radiation Protection (ICNIRP)
Quote:
If OFCOM don't have an email address for you I assume they'll send you a paper letter.
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7th Mar 2021, 4:25 pm | #78 | |
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Re: OFCOM re: International Commission on Non-Ionizing Radiation Protection (ICNIRP)
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I got an email from Ofcom too. |
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7th Mar 2021, 5:06 pm | #79 |
Dekatron
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Location: Penrith, Cumbria, UK.
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Re: OFCOM re: International Commission on Non-Ionizing Radiation Protection (ICNIRP)
I think you’ll find that the impact of EMF from the Droitwich transmitter is minimal in the public domain, and is nothing to be concerned about; it has to be, by law. Much work and numerous surveys at high power broadcast sites has gone into ensuring the public levels are not exceeded.
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7th Mar 2021, 5:39 pm | #80 | |
Tetrode
Join Date: Mar 2019
Location: York, North Yorkshire, UK.
Posts: 95
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Re: OFCOM re: International Commission on Non-Ionizing Radiation Protection (ICNIRP)
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I've been hearing similar statements for as long as I've been licenced. It's probably not helpful in the present atmosphere of conspiracy theories... Back in the real world - I suspect that Ofcom aren't happy about having to do this - they have lots of other pressures on their resources and budget, and they will want the minimum amount of enforcement commitment. (Bear in mind that the mandatory station inspections requirement was dumped years ago - to reduce costs). This activity is probably a preemptive response to head off the anti-5g conspiracy nutters. I would guess that the actual number of Ofcom site visits will be very small indeed, and only in extreme cases. I think a polite but firm response to neighbour complaints is probably the best way forward. An ICNIRP- compliant self assessment a key to this. It's for them to demonstrate that your station is a potential hazard to them, and that their issues are reasonable (get it in writing!). A past neighbour of mine who made ominous noises was referred politely to OFCOM. Nothing further heard, of course.
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