Philips 22cs1002 - UK Vintage Radio Repair and Restoration Discussion Forum

kayler333 · 22nd Apr 2021, 12:43 pm

Hi all just picked up a philips k30 chassis tv it's all great apart from a vertical colour line though the picture, it's OK on raster but when tuned to my vhs the line is visible any suggestions?

kayler333 · 22nd Apr 2021, 3:16 pm

Here's a couple of pictures

Heatercathodeshort · 22nd Apr 2021, 3:31 pm

That is really weird and I don't think I have ever seen a fault like that before.
At first sight it looks like a screen burn that may have been caused by a dry joint line lin coil giving a line collapse but your pictures don't show this on the coloured parts and it appears to be off center.

If it only displays this when playing back VHS tapes it might be some strange incompatibility between the VCR and the TV. I presume you are playing it back via the VCR button on the K30?

It could be a mechanical fault within the CRT but a first for me. No doubt you will get a better answer from another TV guy. They are a clever lot! John.

peter_scott · 22nd Apr 2021, 3:38 pm

I don't suppose it is a visual indication of the carrier frequency generated by the video modulator or possibly the frequency its receiver is tuned to? Perhaps the video is in a tuning mode?

Peter

Welsh Anorak · 22nd Apr 2021, 3:55 pm

If you'd shown me the picture without the TV I'd have said it was an LCD set with a screen fault!
Can we have a look at the TV displaying 'snow'? Also does it vary with the channel position you're using?
I agree - it's not something I've seen before. If possible try another signal source, such as a Freeview box with modulator, and maybe try moving the VCR off the top of the TV.
I think you can hear us all clutching at straws here...

kayler333 · 22nd Apr 2021, 4:04 pm

Thankyou for your replies, I have tried another vcr in a different tuning position and it's just the same,will put a picture of the raster up for you

kayler333 · 22nd Apr 2021, 4:08 pm

There's no line on the raster and when tv is switched off there's no line on the screen

gallowfields · 22nd Apr 2021, 4:41 pm

as glyn suggests, i would also try the vcr on the floor to start with .once had a very similar situation many years ago with a sharp vc7700 .the vcr sat on a shelf in the tv cabine t under the tv and the gap was too small cured with foil under the tv cabinet

kayler333 · 22nd Apr 2021, 5:01 pm

Vcr is now on the floor away from tv but it hasn't worked line is still present

Welsh Anorak · 22nd Apr 2021, 5:03 pm

This is very strange. There's a slight lack of width, and I wonder if there might be a power supply fault that's somehow interfering with the VCR?
Is there any other sounce you could try - maybe another VCR or similar?

Nickthedentist · 22nd Apr 2021, 5:11 pm

The vertical line reminds me of the tuning indication found on a particular early 80s Hitachi mono portable.

Like everyone else, I’ve never seen one of these do that.

kayler333 · 22nd Apr 2021, 5:12 pm

I've tried 2 vcrs and tried tuning them on different channels but it's just the same it does appear to be something with the tv rather than the version, both versions check out OK on my old hitachi set

kayler333 · 22nd Apr 2021, 5:13 pm

It is frustrating because otherwise the tv is in perfect condition

kayler333 · 22nd Apr 2021, 5:18 pm

Just tried it with my old atari 2600 and yes I'm afraid the line is there

Simon Gittins · 22nd Apr 2021, 5:25 pm

As per post 3, are you using the dedicated VCR button?

If not, try it and if you are, try another one. This just might give a clue (although it has me puzzled at the moment).

kayler333 · 22nd Apr 2021, 5:40 pm

Yes I've tried all buttons including channel 8 vcr, the vcrs both work OK with my old hitachi tv

Sideband · 22nd Apr 2021, 6:54 pm

Suggestion: Its not visible on a snowy raster because there is no chroma present. Looking at the first pictures it appears that colour (or some colour ) is missing where the strip is. I have seen a similar effect when the decoupling to the supply for the RGB amps is faulty. Suggest check decoupling of RGB driver supply (I think it's a 155V supply from memory) and the decoupler is a 4.7uF 200V. Older circuits might show it as 47uF. Also try any decouplers on the supply to the chroma decoder.

Odd effect admittedly and it led us a merry dance in the old Philips workshop when we first saw it until someone suggested scoping the supplies.....!

Heatercathodeshort · 22nd Apr 2021, 7:59 pm

Can you display a live picture via a digibox? You may be able to connect it via your VCR if it does not have an RF output. The problem being that it will introduce the VCR as a link and somewhat defeat the elimination of the VCR. John.

peter_scott · 22nd Apr 2021, 9:02 pm

If the TV performs auto-tuning try running it again and watch what happens on the screen.

Peter

slidertogrid · 22nd Apr 2021, 9:11 pm

It is certainly a strange fault! Is the chip on the decoder board fitted in a holder or soldered into the board? The IC holders used to cause odd effects on the text versions. I suppose you could try cleaning the edge connectors on the decoder and RGB boards? if you turn the colour control right down is the line still there on the monochrome picture?

22nd Apr 2021, 12:43 pm	#1
kayler333 Triode Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: Lowestoft, Suffolk, UK. Posts: 34	Philips 22cs1002 Hi all just picked up a philips k30 chassis tv it's all great apart from a vertical colour line though the picture, it's OK on raster but when tuned to my vhs the line is visible any suggestions?

22nd Apr 2021, 3:16 pm	#2
kayler333 Triode Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: Lowestoft, Suffolk, UK. Posts: 34	Re: Philips 22cs1002 Here's a couple of pictures Attached Thumbnails

22nd Apr 2021, 3:31 pm	#3
Heatercathodeshort Dekatron Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Warnham, West Sussex. 10 miles south of DORKING. Posts: 9,147	Re: Philips 22cs1002 That is really weird and I don't think I have ever seen a fault like that before. At first sight it looks like a screen burn that may have been caused by a dry joint line lin coil giving a line collapse but your pictures don't show this on the coloured parts and it appears to be off center. If it only displays this when playing back VHS tapes it might be some strange incompatibility between the VCR and the TV. I presume you are playing it back via the VCR button on the K30? It could be a mechanical fault within the CRT but a first for me. No doubt you will get a better answer from another TV guy. They are a clever lot! John.

22nd Apr 2021, 3:38 pm	#4
peter_scott Dekatron Join Date: May 2003 Location: Edinburgh, UK. Posts: 3,274	Re: Philips 22cs1002 I don't suppose it is a visual indication of the carrier frequency generated by the video modulator or possibly the frequency its receiver is tuned to? Perhaps the video is in a tuning mode? Peter __________________ http://www.nostalgiatech.co.uk https://www.youtube.com/c/PeterScott/videos

22nd Apr 2021, 3:55 pm	#5
Welsh Anorak Dekatron Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: North Wales, UK. Posts: 6,925	Re: Philips 22cs1002 If you'd shown me the picture without the TV I'd have said it was an LCD set with a screen fault! Can we have a look at the TV displaying 'snow'? Also does it vary with the channel position you're using? I agree - it's not something I've seen before. If possible try another signal source, such as a Freeview box with modulator, and maybe try moving the VCR off the top of the TV. I think you can hear us all clutching at straws here... __________________ Glyn www.gdelectronics.wales

22nd Apr 2021, 4:04 pm	#6
kayler333 Triode Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: Lowestoft, Suffolk, UK. Posts: 34	Re: Philips 22cs1002 Thankyou for your replies, I have tried another vcr in a different tuning position and it's just the same,will put a picture of the raster up for you

22nd Apr 2021, 4:08 pm	#7
kayler333 Triode Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: Lowestoft, Suffolk, UK. Posts: 34	Re: Philips 22cs1002 There's no line on the raster and when tv is switched off there's no line on the screen Attached Thumbnails

22nd Apr 2021, 4:41 pm	#8
gallowfields Hexode Join Date: Feb 2018 Location: Durham, County Durham, UK. Posts: 325	Re: Philips 22cs1002 as glyn suggests, i would also try the vcr on the floor to start with .once had a very similar situation many years ago with a sharp vc7700 .the vcr sat on a shelf in the tv cabine t under the tv and the gap was too small cured with foil under the tv cabinet

22nd Apr 2021, 5:01 pm	#9
kayler333 Triode Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: Lowestoft, Suffolk, UK. Posts: 34	Re: Philips 22cs1002 Vcr is now on the floor away from tv but it hasn't worked line is still present Attached Thumbnails

22nd Apr 2021, 5:03 pm	#10
Welsh Anorak Dekatron Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: North Wales, UK. Posts: 6,925	Re: Philips 22cs1002 This is very strange. There's a slight lack of width, and I wonder if there might be a power supply fault that's somehow interfering with the VCR? Is there any other sounce you could try - maybe another VCR or similar? __________________ Glyn www.gdelectronics.wales

22nd Apr 2021, 5:11 pm	#11
Nickthedentist Dekatron Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Oxford, UK. Posts: 17,861	Re: Philips 22cs1002 The vertical line reminds me of the tuning indication found on a particular early 80s Hitachi mono portable. Like everyone else, I’ve never seen one of these do that.

22nd Apr 2021, 5:12 pm	#12
kayler333 Triode Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: Lowestoft, Suffolk, UK. Posts: 34	Re: Philips 22cs1002 I've tried 2 vcrs and tried tuning them on different channels but it's just the same it does appear to be something with the tv rather than the version, both versions check out OK on my old hitachi set

22nd Apr 2021, 5:13 pm	#13
kayler333 Triode Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: Lowestoft, Suffolk, UK. Posts: 34	Re: Philips 22cs1002 It is frustrating because otherwise the tv is in perfect condition

22nd Apr 2021, 5:18 pm	#14
kayler333 Triode Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: Lowestoft, Suffolk, UK. Posts: 34	Re: Philips 22cs1002 Just tried it with my old atari 2600 and yes I'm afraid the line is there

22nd Apr 2021, 5:25 pm	#15
Simon Gittins Heptode Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Cornwall, UK. Posts: 506	Re: Philips 22cs1002 As per post 3, are you using the dedicated VCR button? If not, try it and if you are, try another one. This just might give a clue (although it has me puzzled at the moment).

22nd Apr 2021, 5:40 pm	#16
kayler333 Triode Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: Lowestoft, Suffolk, UK. Posts: 34	Re: Philips 22cs1002 Yes I've tried all buttons including channel 8 vcr, the vcrs both work OK with my old hitachi tv

22nd Apr 2021, 6:54 pm	#17
Sideband Dekatron Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Croydon, Surrey, UK. Posts: 7,578	Re: Philips 22cs1002 Suggestion: Its not visible on a snowy raster because there is no chroma present. Looking at the first pictures it appears that colour (or some colour ) is missing where the strip is. I have seen a similar effect when the decoupling to the supply for the RGB amps is faulty. Suggest check decoupling of RGB driver supply (I think it's a 155V supply from memory) and the decoupler is a 4.7uF 200V. Older circuits might show it as 47uF. Also try any decouplers on the supply to the chroma decoder. Odd effect admittedly and it led us a merry dance in the old Philips workshop when we first saw it until someone suggested scoping the supplies.....! __________________ There are lots of brilliant keyboard players and then there is Rick Wakeman.....

22nd Apr 2021, 7:59 pm	#18
Heatercathodeshort Dekatron Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Warnham, West Sussex. 10 miles south of DORKING. Posts: 9,147	Re: Philips 22cs1002 Can you display a live picture via a digibox? You may be able to connect it via your VCR if it does not have an RF output. The problem being that it will introduce the VCR as a link and somewhat defeat the elimination of the VCR. John.

22nd Apr 2021, 9:02 pm	#19
peter_scott Dekatron Join Date: May 2003 Location: Edinburgh, UK. Posts: 3,274	Re: Philips 22cs1002 If the TV performs auto-tuning try running it again and watch what happens on the screen. Peter __________________ http://www.nostalgiatech.co.uk https://www.youtube.com/c/PeterScott/videos

22nd Apr 2021, 9:11 pm	#20
slidertogrid Octode Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Peterborough, Cambridgeshire, UK. Posts: 1,898	Re: Philips 22cs1002 It is certainly a strange fault! Is the chip on the decoder board fitted in a holder or soldered into the board? The IC holders used to cause odd effects on the text versions. I suppose you could try cleaning the edge connectors on the decoder and RGB boards? if you turn the colour control right down is the line still there on the monochrome picture?