Government review on Radio and Audio - Page 2 - UK Vintage Radio Repair and Restoration Discussion Forum

Nuvistor · 28th Oct 2021, 8:06 am

Published today the RAJAR radio listening figures April to September 2021. FM/AM still shows a healthy 34% of the audience. However listening figures are much higher for digital reception of all types, online showing 18% which would have been unheard of 10 years ago.

If AM/FM were switched off now I think the response would be similar to Norway with a good portion of listeners being lost, what those figures would be like in 9 years time will be interesting to see.

https://www.rajar.co.uk/docs/news/RA...phicQ32021.pdf

Boulevardier · 28th Oct 2021, 4:54 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nuvistor

Published today the RAJAR radio listening figures April to September 2021. FM/AM still shows a healthy 34% of the audience. However listening figures are much higher for digital reception of all types, online showing 18% which would have been unheard of 10 years ago.

If AM/FM were switched off now I think the response would be similar to Norway with a good portion of listeners being lost, what those figures would be like in 9 years time will be interesting to see.

https://www.rajar.co.uk/docs/news/RA...phicQ32021.pdf

Do the RAJAR figures give listening figures specifically for DAB, or do they just lump all "digital" together?

Mike

agardiner · 28th Oct 2021, 5:05 pm

There are DAB figures if you drill down on the report a bit.

28th Oct 2021, 5:07 pm

I like DAB I can get my favourite stations with good quality, all BBC, 4, 4 Extra and the World Service.

G6Tanuki · 28th Oct 2021, 6:30 pm

It's interesting that the usual station-idents these days seemingly don't mention DAB.

"On your smartspeaker, on your radio and on Global Player" seems to be the current mantra.

Pragmatically, I suspect most listeners would get a broader choice of stations on their smartspeaker/phone than on DAB [or AM or FM].

agardiner · 28th Oct 2021, 7:03 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by G6Tanuki

It's interesting that the usual station-idents these days seemingly don't mention DAB.

"On your smartspeaker, on your radio and on Global Player" seems to be the current mantra.

Pragmatically, I suspect most listeners would get a broader choice of stations on their smartspeaker/phone than on DAB [or AM or FM].

Yes, I've often thought the same. Even the BBC don't mention DAB.

DennisCA · 8th Nov 2021, 2:27 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hampus

As a person living outside UK it is interesting to compare. In Sweden the government has decided to abandon the intended switch to DAB, at least for the foreseeable future Our national broadcaster did some attempts some years ago but since then most of these transmissions has been shut off. In 1999 it covered 85% of the population but in 2002 this was reduced to 35% which still is the current coverage.

The governments argument has mainly been these:

-There is almost no public demand
-Too many radios will be unusable
-Defence- and catastrophic transmissions may be affected negatively.

In our neighbour country Norway the national broadcaster NRK left FM in 2017, over a night they lost 20% of their listeners and have still not recovered.

Here in Finland we abandonded DAB back in 2005. I hope it stays that way personally. Don't see a need or reason to move to FM radio to digital.

In my dream world there'd be a renewal in the MW and SW range but I don't have a lot of hope for that.

Glowing Bits! · 8th Nov 2021, 2:57 pm

This subject could be political so on that note, I won't mention the BBC!
Most of my listening these days is online, the quality of online stations is marginally better than DAB but streaming on Deezer is far superior, the future is online.
Will I miss analog? Possibly but it's more about nostalgia than practical, if that makes sense.

Vintage Engr · 18th Dec 2021, 7:11 pm

Last year I bought a new car... It came of course with a radio that sported DAB, FM & AM.

It's brilliant on FM, pulls in stations from miles away; as good as it gets on AM - i.e. it receives any transmissions that are there + the 'pantry' transmitter (Modulated Test Oscillator!), - but totally useless where I live on DAB, no signal from anywhere despite being over 800' ASL.

Long live FM

David.

Andrew2 · 19th Dec 2021, 1:26 am

That sounds a little strange. Are you sure it is set up to scan correctly? The DAB radio in our car was missing quite a lot of stations we were sure should be present, but we eventually found it was set to 'national' rather than 'regional' (or possibly the other way round).

David G4EBT · 19th Dec 2021, 2:21 pm

I have a DAB/FM/AM radio in my study, and a DAB/FM/AM radio in my car

Whether FM stays or goes isn't a topic that I have any strong views on, but I never listen to AM, (except of course on my vintage radios), or FM. There are just so many more stations on DAB, and I don't have any reception problems either locally or on journeys to London, Essex, Oxford East Midlands, Lincolnshire, West Yorks, and other places. Neither do I notice any difference in the audio quality.

I do mourn the closure of so many Short-Wave broadcast stations, and recall my SWL days in the 50s - 70s, when the simplest little home-brew one-valve radio would pull in stations from afar, but that was then, this is now.

paulsherwin · 19th Dec 2021, 2:31 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vintage Engr

Last year I bought a new car... It came of course with a radio that sported DAB, FM & AM.

It's brilliant on FM, pulls in stations from miles away; as good as it gets on AM - i.e. it receives any transmissions that are there + the 'pantry' transmitter (Modulated Test Oscillator!), - but totally useless where I live on DAB, no signal from anywhere despite being over 800' ASL.

There are some curious reception gaps in mid Shropshire. I think you should be getting DAB from The Wrekin, but it may be being beamed eastwards to Wolverhampton, and the powers are quite low. The geography is very hilly which doesn't help.

Junk Box Nick · 19th Dec 2021, 3:26 pm

Particular location in Shropshire is going to count for a lot – especially if you are in the west of the county. I think there are a few Radio Shropshire FM relays in the valleys there. R Shropshire also has DAB from Turner’s Hill and my father listened to it a lot as he preferred it to the somewhat ‘urban’ Radio WM.

Living in a high but slightly peculiar location terrain-wise, some folk in my street get their TV from the Wrekin despite the signals crossing two county boundaries. (I can get Sutton.) I can get far more DAB signals than my friends in lower lying locations a mile and a half away, despite the fact that they are supposedly in the service area of the missing stations.

On an analogue set I still find LW useful and more reliable than FM for Radio 4.

Vintage Engr · 19th Dec 2021, 3:32 pm

I can see the Wrekin from here, from my workshop window, but as has been said the power is quite low.
The radio does work on DAB, when I drive down to London, no problem.

It's just here that there is absolutely nothing. So I shall stick with FM as long as possible.

David.

19th Dec 2021, 4:43 pm

I have a DAB radio on my motorcycle, it works well, I like having the World Service and 4 Extra. It has a weird feature in that when the signal fades it it replaced by white noise to simulate an FM signal fading, it almost sounds like it too!

tony brady · 19th Dec 2021, 5:56 pm

Is that not the DAB falling back to FM but not finding a signal?

G6Tanuki · 19th Dec 2021, 6:28 pm

If you're having DAB-reception problens with a car radio, go into the config menus and check you've got things right.

My daily-driver 2018 car has the ability to select a range of DAb services

L-band

Band III

L-band & Band III

L-band and Canada

L-band and Canada and US.

US [Sirius/XM]

It also has menu-options to switch between 9 and 10KHz channel-steps on AM/MW and European/US or Japanese steps on FM.

Alas, setting it to the US option has never got me the option to enter my subscriber-code for Sirius/XM satellite-radio.

duncanlowe · 19th Dec 2021, 7:48 pm

The UI on some DAB devices leaves a bit to be desired. DAB is broadcast in 'ensembles' which is similar to the 'multiplexes' on digital TV. I have seen UIs on receivers that inisit you select the station, by first selecting the ensemble that it belongs to. Now who is ever going to understand that. Post number 30 sounds like you were having to do this exact thing as the national and local are ensembles.

duncanlowe · 19th Dec 2021, 7:51 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by G6Tanuki

Alas, setting it to the US option has never got me the option to enter my subscriber-code for Sirius/XM satellite-radio.

I guess that's because we are somewhat outside the beam pattern?

20th Dec 2021, 9:12 am

Quote:

Is that not the DAB falling back to FM but not finding a signal?

It doesn't have FM!

28th Oct 2021, 8:06 am	#21
Nuvistor Dekatron Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Wigan, Greater Manchester, UK. Posts: 9,433	Re: Government review on Radio and Audio Published today the RAJAR radio listening figures April to September 2021. FM/AM still shows a healthy 34% of the audience. However listening figures are much higher for digital reception of all types, online showing 18% which would have been unheard of 10 years ago. If AM/FM were switched off now I think the response would be similar to Norway with a good portion of listeners being lost, what those figures would be like in 9 years time will be interesting to see. https://www.rajar.co.uk/docs/news/RA...phicQ32021.pdf __________________ Frank

28th Oct 2021, 5:05 pm	#23
agardiner Octode Join Date: Sep 2020 Location: Thetford, Norfolk, UK. Posts: 1,741	Re: Government review on Radio and Audio There are DAB figures if you drill down on the report a bit.

28th Oct 2021, 5:07 pm	#24
Guest Guest Posts: n/a	Re: Government review on Radio and Audio I like DAB I can get my favourite stations with good quality, all BBC, 4, 4 Extra and the World Service.

28th Oct 2021, 6:30 pm	#25
G6Tanuki Dekatron Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Wiltshire, UK. Posts: 13,998	Re: Government review on Radio and Audio It's interesting that the usual station-idents these days seemingly don't mention DAB. "On your smartspeaker, on your radio and on Global Player" seems to be the current mantra. Pragmatically, I suspect most listeners would get a broader choice of stations on their smartspeaker/phone than on DAB [or AM or FM]. __________________ I'm the Operator of my Pocket Calculator. -Kraftwerk.

8th Nov 2021, 2:57 pm	#28
Glowing Bits! Octode Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Wrexham, North Wales, UK. Posts: 1,457	Re: Government review on Radio and Audio This subject could be political so on that note, I won't mention the BBC! Most of my listening these days is online, the quality of online stations is marginally better than DAB but streaming on Deezer is far superior, the future is online. Will I miss analog? Possibly but it's more about nostalgia than practical, if that makes sense. __________________ Rick, the annoying object roaming the forum.

18th Dec 2021, 7:11 pm	#29
Vintage Engr Heptode Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Shrewsbury, Shropshire, UK. Posts: 841	Re: Government review on Radio and Audio Last year I bought a new car... It came of course with a radio that sported DAB, FM & AM. It's brilliant on FM, pulls in stations from miles away; as good as it gets on AM - i.e. it receives any transmissions that are there + the 'pantry' transmitter (Modulated Test Oscillator!), - but totally useless where I live on DAB, no signal from anywhere despite being over 800' ASL. Long live FM David.

19th Dec 2021, 1:26 am	#30
Andrew2 Nonode Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Dukinfield, Cheshire, UK. Posts: 2,037	Re: Government review on Radio and Audio That sounds a little strange. Are you sure it is set up to scan correctly? The DAB radio in our car was missing quite a lot of stations we were sure should be present, but we eventually found it was set to 'national' rather than 'regional' (or possibly the other way round). __________________ Andy G1HBE.

19th Dec 2021, 2:21 pm	#31
David G4EBT Dekatron Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Cottingham, East Yorkshire, UK. Posts: 5,761	Re: Government review on Radio and Audio I have a DAB/FM/AM radio in my study, and a DAB/FM/AM radio in my car Whether FM stays or goes isn't a topic that I have any strong views on, but I never listen to AM, (except of course on my vintage radios), or FM. There are just so many more stations on DAB, and I don't have any reception problems either locally or on journeys to London, Essex, Oxford East Midlands, Lincolnshire, West Yorks, and other places. Neither do I notice any difference in the audio quality. I do mourn the closure of so many Short-Wave broadcast stations, and recall my SWL days in the 50s - 70s, when the simplest little home-brew one-valve radio would pull in stations from afar, but that was then, this is now. __________________ David. BVWS Member. G-QRP Club member 1339.

19th Dec 2021, 3:26 pm	#33
Junk Box Nick Octode Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: West Midlands, UK. Posts: 1,571	Re: Government review on Radio and Audio Particular location in Shropshire is going to count for a lot – especially if you are in the west of the county. I think there are a few Radio Shropshire FM relays in the valleys there. R Shropshire also has DAB from Turner’s Hill and my father listened to it a lot as he preferred it to the somewhat ‘urban’ Radio WM. Living in a high but slightly peculiar location terrain-wise, some folk in my street get their TV from the Wrekin despite the signals crossing two county boundaries. (I can get Sutton.) I can get far more DAB signals than my friends in lower lying locations a mile and a half away, despite the fact that they are supposedly in the service area of the missing stations. On an analogue set I still find LW useful and more reliable than FM for Radio 4.

19th Dec 2021, 3:32 pm	#34
Vintage Engr Heptode Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Shrewsbury, Shropshire, UK. Posts: 841	Re: Government review on Radio and Audio I can see the Wrekin from here, from my workshop window, but as has been said the power is quite low. The radio does work on DAB, when I drive down to London, no problem. It's just here that there is absolutely nothing. So I shall stick with FM as long as possible. David.

19th Dec 2021, 4:43 pm	#35
Guest Guest Posts: n/a	Re: Government review on Radio and Audio I have a DAB radio on my motorcycle, it works well, I like having the World Service and 4 Extra. It has a weird feature in that when the signal fades it it replaced by white noise to simulate an FM signal fading, it almost sounds like it too!

19th Dec 2021, 5:56 pm	#36
tony brady Hexode Join Date: Mar 2014 Location: Peacehaven, East Sussex, UK. Posts: 278	Re: Government review on Radio and Audio Is that not the DAB falling back to FM but not finding a signal?

19th Dec 2021, 6:28 pm	#37
G6Tanuki Dekatron Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Wiltshire, UK. Posts: 13,998	Re: Government review on Radio and Audio If you're having DAB-reception problens with a car radio, go into the config menus and check you've got things right. My daily-driver 2018 car has the ability to select a range of DAb services L-band Band III L-band & Band III L-band and Canada L-band and Canada and US. US [Sirius/XM] It also has menu-options to switch between 9 and 10KHz channel-steps on AM/MW and European/US or Japanese steps on FM. Alas, setting it to the US option has never got me the option to enter my subscriber-code for Sirius/XM satellite-radio. __________________ I'm the Operator of my Pocket Calculator. -Kraftwerk.

19th Dec 2021, 7:48 pm	#38
duncanlowe Nonode Join Date: Jan 2016 Location: Stafford, Staffs. UK. Posts: 2,532	Re: Government review on Radio and Audio The UI on some DAB devices leaves a bit to be desired. DAB is broadcast in 'ensembles' which is similar to the 'multiplexes' on digital TV. I have seen UIs on receivers that inisit you select the station, by first selecting the ensemble that it belongs to. Now who is ever going to understand that. Post number 30 sounds like you were having to do this exact thing as the national and local are ensembles.