Saturday morning stereo

[TALKINGWITHPYE]

Does anyone remember the days before stereo broadcasting on the radio. On a Saturday morning one channel was broadcast on radio 3 I think and the other channel was broadcast on BBC television to give people an introduction to stereo broadcasting wich was coming.

[Ted Kendall]

Indeed, the two transmitter experiments ran from 1958 to 1964, with Third Programme on one side and VHF television sound on the other. Multiplex experimental transmissions ran from 1962. I wasn't around at the time, but have some tapes from these transmissions, and the quality is pretty good, different programme chains notwithstanding. On occasion, the TV sound had to be routed as far as Manchester and back to get the two channels reasonably in step. Judging by the correspondence the BBC received, these transmissions excited a lot of interest, more than colour television for a time.

The two transmitter experiments ended in 1964, when expansion of the Music Programme (precursor to Radio 3) required the Third frequency on Sarurday mornings. International prevarication delayed official adoption of the Zenith/GE multiplex system until 1966. I have an off-air tape labelled as the first official multiplex transmission - a Beethoven symphony relayed from Maida Vale 1.

[Nuvistor]

Yes I remember them, all a bit vague now after all this time but it was an interesting experiment.

[barrymagrec]

I remember reading about the broadcasts in my Uncle`s passed on Hi Fi news magazines but could not try it out since at the time our Chapman tuner and ECL82 amplifier shared the 10 inch? speaker in the Bush 9 inch console TV on an either or basis.

[emeritus]

I well remember reading about the experimental broadcasts in the Radio Times. We had a radiogram with FM, and I am sure dad would have been interested, but he was working until lunchtime most Saturdays.

[Reelman]

I can remember trying this out one Saturday morning even though I was only 8 in ‘64. Used a transistor set on the Third and the telly for the other channel. Presumably was radiated on MW as well as FM Third since of course the TV sound would have been AM anyway. If it was on BBC Two then we wouldn’t have been able to receive it as we didn’t have a dual standard set at that time.

Can’t really remember if I was impressed or not, would certainly have been the first stereo I had heard.

Peter

[Craig Sawyers]

In 1979, just recently married, our landlady gave us a 405 line black and white TV in an impressive veneered wooden case. She said it did not work, but that I could probably fix it.

It just had a mains dropper which had burnt out. I off-wound the resistance wire, measured the resistance of both ends, and used a modern power resistor. Fine - it worked. Sound was nothing to write home about, but I did have an excellent hifi system but no way to connect a mains TV chassis to the sound system.

But I did have a Heathkit valved, mono, FM tuner.

So I got hold of a transistorised TV tuner , and tweaked down the output so it fell in the FM band. I could therefore tune into the audio carrier. I forget all the details with the passage of decades, but that was the gist.

So we could watch 405 line TV with hifi sound. We watched the first shuttle launch on that system.

Slightly off topic, but not entirely unlike the early stereo broadcasts split between radio and TV.

Craig

[Hartley118]

I remember them well. Was it as recent as 1958? I though it might have been earlier. It was the first occasion that I recall experiencing the 'spaciousness' of stereo.

The experiment involved moving the Pye V17 console TV to the left hand side of the bay window and arranging the Wharfedale 'Golden' 10-inch extension speaker to the right hand side. That Wharfedale was supposedly the best that Gilbert Briggs had to offer before WW2 and was fed from the Pye T10 'family' radio (1935 model) which lived in the back room.

ISTR that, because the listener's speaker phasing was entirely random, the programme was transmitted twice with phase reversed on one channel the second time. I can't recall noticing much difference!

The most striking programme content that I remember was 'Wouldn't it be Loverly' from My Fair Lady, presumably with Julie Andrews. The vocalist stood out particularly clearly from the backing.

it would be interesting to hear that tape - it would recall lost memories.

Martin

[dave walsh]

As Peter says [post 6] Radio 3 [The Third Program] was on MW for most people back then. I managed to get an AM set in the vicinity of the TV [possibly a Sobell Valve job that my Gran gave me] but I don't recall being very impressed FM reception was an unknown country back then. There have been a number of threads on this subject in the past which might be still around

Dave W

[Ted Kendall]

Originally Posted by Hartley118

I remember them well. Was it as recent as 1958? I though it might have been earlier. It was the first occasion that I recall experiencing the 'spaciousness' of stereo.

ISTR that, because the listener's speaker phasing was entirely random, the programme was transmitted twice with phase reversed on one channel the second time. I can't recall noticing much difference!

The most striking programme content that I remember was 'Wouldn't it be Loverly' from My Fair Lady, presumably with Julie Andrews. The vocalist stood out particularly clearly from the backing.

it would be interesting to hear that tape - it would recall lost memories.

Martin

That is one of the programmes I have - somewhere...it was transmitted in Gramophone Week in 1958, and consisted of extracts from commercial recordings. The whole programme was transmitted twice with a phase reverse for the repetition, which was done live. Later transmissions relied on the listener sorting his connections out on the opening announcement - the transmitting end had to juggle delays on the test card music which was sent over both chains before the actual programme to get left and right as close as possible. When everything went right, the stereo effect was quite decent, although probably a mono sum wouldn't have sounded too good.

[winston_1]

I remember these and had a go at listening. The radio was a Pilot Little Maestro and the TV an Ekco 14". The audio quality of both was poor which rather spoiled the end result. Around the same time similar tests were being made on the continent (France I think) using LW 164kHz and one of the MW transmitters. I tried listening to these as well using the above Little Maestro and a pocket transistor.

In the 70s the BBC did similar quad tests using the Light Programme FM stereo as the front pair and the Third Programme FM stereo as the rear. I used my FM tuner for the front but I did not have another stereo unit for the tear so I used a mono portable. It worked surprisingly well though. I remember hearing birds all around me.

[eddie_ce]

I must have been twelve and was very excited to listen to the stereo transmissions. I was very disappointed with the result. We didn't have an FM receiver and so I had to listen to the third programme on medium-wave.

Later I seem to remember reading that the test signal was only transmitted on FM, the AM transmission being the normal signal. I believe the stereo test signal was only transmitted via the Wrotham FM transmitter.

Can anyone verify this. At least it would explain my disappointment at the time, not having had FM available.

[Hartley118]

I was certainly on medium wave for the Third programme channel - and it worked for me.

Martin

[stevehertz]

I don't remember them but I did listen to the BBC FM stereo broadcasts and watched the simultaneous TV broadcasts of rock bands on a Saturday afternoon in around 1976. I think Camel were one of the first bands to be featured.

[Dave757]

Hi,

Yes, I remember it well. We used a Portadyne Princess for the Third Programme
(was it on 464mtrs?) and our McMichael TV for Channel 4 BBCTV (Sutton Coldfield).
It was quite impressive really.

Kind regards
Dave.

[Ted Kendall]

The same signal went out on all Third Programme frequencies for the experimental transmissions, both AM and FM.

The Sight and Sound In Concert strand was great fun and worked very well, until an industrial dispute caused the synchronisation between the video and stereo recordings to be neglected, and then the results were risible.

[rontech]

I remember this in 1958. I lugged the ekco 17" table model into lounge with yards of co-ax extension cable from the living room. I think I used my hifi system in the lounge which was mono. GEC 9/12 amp, goodmans axiom 150 Mk2 in corner baffle cabinet.

The results were quite impressive at the time.

[Ian B]

I too remember listening in 1958/9 when we lived just outside Gloucester. The TV (an old BBC-only Murphy) in the sitting room, and the radio (War-time Civilian Receiver with LW added) in the dining room. I stood in the hall between the doors to each room and the recording of a passing steam train was most impressive to a 12 year old.
Ian Blackbourn

[saxmaniac]

In a similar subject does anyone remember BBC doing quadrophonic transmissions using 2 FM stereo channels probably R3 and R2? Might have been mid 1970s. I didn't have the equipment to listen but would have been interested to see what it was like. It was around Christmas and I hoped they would repeat the exercise the following year when I did have the equipment but it only happened that once

[KeithsTV]

I remember the quadrophonic transmissions as I took my tuner, amp & speakers round to a friends house and we set it up in time for the late night broadcast. I can't remember much about it except being impressed by a sound travelling diagonally between the front and rear speakers. I think it was around 1973/4.

This looks like the broadcast https://genome.ch.bbc.co.uk/5c91d7ea...a8f9f158bb044d

Keith