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Old 18th Sep 2009, 5:48 pm   #1
BakeliteBear
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Default Removal of pulse dialling option??

I keep reading that BT/Virgin etc is going to remove the pulse dialling option on their exchanges and that some exchanges already do not accept pulse dialling.

Does anyone actually know if this is true? Personally I have never had any problems, but it seems to be a very tenacious rumour. Can anyone put this to bed once and for all??
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Old 18th Sep 2009, 6:57 pm   #2
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Default Re: Removal of pulse dialling option??

Hi,
As far as I am aware BT already have some areas where it is only possible to use Tone dialing phones. Virgin Media/Ntl sill have the pulse option but some of the Nortel switches used by their network aren't quite as forgiving as the BT switches are regarding variations in pulse train (i.e. dial) speed.

I have some acquaintances on the "inside" as it were so will make inquiries at an opportune moment and rport back.

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Old 18th Sep 2009, 7:17 pm   #3
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Default Re: Removal of pulse dialling option??

Thanks Andrew that would be excellent.

Do you know what in areas BT don’t accept pulse dialling?

I am aware that it is generally accepted that some of the exchanges are not so accepting of variations in dial speed and make/break ratios, but I have not been able to extablish definitively if they still work to BT’s standard of 10PPS and a ratio of 66/33. A dealer’s technician has told me that the ‘new’ standard is 10PPS and a ratio of 70/30. I have tried to talk to Virgin about this but they are a total waste of time!
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Old 17th Oct 2009, 10:37 pm   #4
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Default Re: Removal of pulse dialling option??

Has anyone got any updates on this one?? It seems pretty key to our continued use of vintage telephones.
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Old 17th Oct 2009, 11:22 pm   #5
Graeme Murphy
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Default Re: Removal of pulse dialling option??

At some time in the near future this mode of operation will be removed from the exchanges so has anyone designed a convertor to take pulses and convert them to tones?
Nice project for a designer to get into and it should not be too difficult to do.
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Old 18th Oct 2009, 1:03 am   #6
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Default Re: Removal of pulse dialling option??

There's one available from the USA which apparently is ok for use in the UK.

On the matter of designing such a device, I wondered the other day if it'd be feasible to cobble something up using parts from the circuit of one of those telephones that can be switched between pulse and tone dialling. I've never examined such a 'phone into order to determine how they function though; they could have two seperate circuits for all I know.
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Old 18th Oct 2009, 6:44 am   #7
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Default Re: Removal of pulse dialling option??

‘Dial-Rider’ (I think it has been re-branded for the USA which is the big market) has been developed by Mike Wilkinson - its a small device that sits between the dial and the telephone - problem solved!

Sorry to keep banging on about this but when is 'some time in the near future'? I have contacted both Virgin and BT to ask which of their exchanges still accept pulse dialling - what a waste of time. They were both unable to let me talk to someone who even understood the question, let alone new the answer!!

In am determined to get to the bottom of this, so does anyone have a contact who I can write to or ring who actually knows which exchanges don’t accept pulse dialling and when the big 'switch off' will take place
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Old 18th Oct 2009, 9:32 am   #8
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Default Re: Removal of pulse dialling option??

Quote:
Originally Posted by BakeliteBear View Post

'I am determined to get to the bottom of this, so does anyone have a contact who I can write to or ring who actually knows which exchanges don’t accept pulse dialling and when the big 'switch off' will take place'
I dont forsee any 'big switch off' merely to rid the country of pulse-dialling, if the exchange equipment that accepts pulse-dialling is working perfectly satisfactorily in tandem with DTMF; it would be uneconomic, surely, so to do? Can't be more than a couple of chips or a software command or two?

I only envisage removal if the exchange has to be upgraded entirely to equipment that simply won't accept LD, like some PABXs currently. If everyone was transferred to a VOIP, system, for example, where the 'last-mile' cct (ie: the bit to your house) was transparent insofar as there would be no change to existing copper pairs.

One justified exception, though: If there is continued trouble with mis-dialling (by line-clicks) the pan-European 112 emergency number, it may be regarded as a nuisance and the LD facility might then be withdrawn.
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Old 18th Oct 2009, 9:51 am   #9
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Default Re: Removal of pulse dialling option??

Quote:
Originally Posted by Darren-UK View Post
There's one available from the USA which apparently is ok for use in the UK.

On the matter of designing such a device, I wondered the other day if it'd be feasible to cobble something up using parts from the circuit of one of those telephones that can be switched between pulse and tone dialling. I've never examined such a 'phone into order to determine how they function though; they could have two seperate circuits for all I know.
I have just got the Dialgizmo.
It works well, and on moast phones/lines you may dial * and # too.
dsk

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Old 18th Oct 2009, 12:38 pm   #10
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Default Re: Removal of pulse dialling option??

If BT were able to remove pulse dialling I'm sure they would do so, as it is the only sure way of overcoming the false calls to 112 problem. I can think of two reasons why they haven't done so. Firstly it may be a condition of their licence that the pulse dialling option is retained for a set period of time. Secondly BT payphones used, and may be still use, pulse dialling exclusively as an anti fraud measure. I won't go into details of the fraud here.

When BT started introducing digital local exchanges in the early 1980s it was essential that they had the ability to handle pulse dialling, as most phones had dials and PABXs which used tone dialling internally still used pulse dialling on their public network connections.

BT used System X and later AXE10 exchanges for its digital local network and they had to support pulse dialling. Some of these exchanges are now more than 25 years old and must be due for replacement. The planned replacement was NGX (Next Generation Switch) made by Ericssons, but a VOIP switch was also being tested.

Whether either of these switches supports pulse dialling I don't know and all my contacts who would know have now retired and the testing work has been outsourced to India.

No one on front desks is going to know about pulse dialling. They just follow on screen menus. I would suggest that the only way to find out the true situation regarding pulse dialling is to send a good old fashioned paper letter to OFCOM or the Telco concerned.
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Old 27th Oct 2009, 5:52 pm   #11
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Default Re: Removal of pulse dialling option??

I have continued to chase this and have been told the following from a friend’s friend who is a BT ‘insider’.

BT currently runs ‘System X’ which it planned to replace in 2000 with ‘Network 2000’. This is Internet based and uses ‘packages’ of information. However, BT ran out of money and failed to secure financial contributions from the other system providers so the project is on indefinite hold. ‘Network 2000’ would put an end to Pulse or Loop Disconnect dialling which BT has no commitment to keep.

Can anyone confirm or expand upon the above??
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Old 27th Oct 2009, 6:36 pm   #12
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Default Re: Removal of pulse dialling option??

I think the dialgizmo mentioned earlier is the answer. It seems that sooner or later pulse dialing will be a thing of the past, and at $40 plus postage its a small price to pay to continue using my bakelite.
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Old 27th Oct 2009, 6:49 pm   #13
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Default Re: Removal of pulse dialling option??

The Rotatone is similar too
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Old 27th Oct 2009, 7:20 pm   #14
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Default Re: Removal of pulse dialling option??

Yes there are ways around it, but don't you feel that a lot of 'non collectors' will just give in? The removal of radio stations from the old broadcasting frequencies might be considered a parallel. The price of vintage radios plummeted when they could not pick up the main stations.
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Old 28th Oct 2009, 12:42 am   #15
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Default Re: Removal of pulse dialling option??

I keep asking this question at work, and am repeatedly assured the BT 21CN network(when installed.................) will support "legacy" sytems, at least for the forseeable future. So your old phones should be fine for a while.

A decade or so when I was "up the poles and down the holes", I went to a customer who was complaining of no outgoing calls. The fault was proved to the exchange, as the customers phone worked perfectly when switched to pulse dial.(Stick with it, it is on topic ....honest) The fault was passed to the exchange to deal and I left the customer and her elderly mother with pulse dial while the fault was investigated. I had another job in the same road a few days later, so called in to enquire if the fault had been cleared. The customer was VERY pleased to see me, and explained her mum had had a heart attack the night after I had called and because the phone was working was able to dial for an ambulance.
Hooray for pulse dial!
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Old 2nd Nov 2009, 1:03 pm   #16
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Default Re: Removal of pulse dialling option??

Another take on things: A retailer is stating that their rotary phones will work on all networks as standard, but for Telewest, they will provide an alternative instrument which will work. I quizzed them about the difference and here's their reply -

The only difference between Telewest and all other providers is that Telewest has no tolerance at all to any differentials in dial speed (i.e. some dials can rotate slightly faster or slower than others). Therefore, we fit a brand new dial (very few and far between) to a phone we know is going to be used on the Telewest network. Obviously, a phone with a brtand new dialshould work on any network, but phones with other dials (unless the dial is actually configured to be 'spot-on' may not work on Telewest but will work on the other networks.

With regards to the future with BT exchanges supporting pulse dialling, I can't answer that. As far as I am aware, all exchanges still being fitted have the facility for pulse dialling as well as tone dialling. Sometimes it isn't switched on at the exchange, but is provided at no cost if required.
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Old 2nd Dec 2009, 4:22 pm   #17
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Default Re: Removal of pulse dialling option??

A comment I overheard a few weeks ago from one of my colleagues, to the effect that the reason that pulse dialing is still supported by BT is... wait for it... "the military". They still rely on it, he stated very confidently as if he was somehow party to some top secret knowledge (which I doubt ).

Absolutely no idea whether this is true or not, so may be best taken with a pinch of salt unless anyone here can corroborate it!
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Old 3rd Dec 2009, 11:04 am   #18
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Default Re: Removal of pulse dialling option??

Well for safety pulse dialing should remain.

If the phones dial is broken, or the tone dialing will not work - one can still 'tap out' the number required on the hook......

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Old 3rd Dec 2009, 1:24 pm   #19
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Default Re: Removal of pulse dialling option??

Quote:
Originally Posted by SeanStevens View Post
'If the phones dial is broken, or the tone dialing will not work - one can still 'tap out' the number required on the hook...'
Now therein lies part of the problem... We in the UK are connected to the pan-European emergency number 112, as well as our own 999. It is uncannily easy to inadvertently tap out a random 1--1---1-1 and summon the emergency services - my late ma-in-law used to do it occasionally when struggling to replace the receiver on-hook.

I don't know if pulse-dialling is still in use in other EU countries, but to my mind this might be seen as good reason to get shot of it; shame if so, when, as you allude, a 'belt-and-braces' signalling system works a treat.

I would sooner get shot of 112, but that's unlikely to happen. I don't think 'The Military' have any reason to keep it, either: their telephone system is full of line-powered DTMF chippery, as is the civilian network. Unless they have a post-EMP Strowger system, hardened local-ends and valved repeaters salted away somewhere...
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Old 4th Dec 2009, 12:44 am   #20
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Default Re: Removal of pulse dialling option??

Quote:
Unless they have a post-EMP Strowger system, hardened local-ends and valved repeaters salted away somewhere...


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