An odd battery - UK Vintage Radio Repair and Restoration Discussion Forum

Alan Stepney · 20th Apr 2010, 7:39 pm

One I have never come across before.

Berec 659 inert cell.

On the back it says, Remove cork and vent plug and fill slowly with fresh drinking water.

Anyone seen one before?
What were they for?

kalee20 · 20th Apr 2010, 8:20 pm

There were cells which didn't produce power, but dropped a constant voltage when current was passed through (a sort of electrolytic Zener diode). Could it be one of these?

helmsman · 20th Apr 2010, 8:29 pm

Or could it be a salt cell ?

Sean Williams · 20th Apr 2010, 8:34 pm

I think the cell is filled with dried potassium hydroxide - this is then turned into a liquid electrolyte paste with the addition of water.

I think this was done to give the cells a long shelf life.

John M0GLN · 21st Apr 2010, 6:04 am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sean Williams

I think the cell is filled with dried potassium hydroxide - this is then turned into a liquid electrolyte paste with the addition of water.

So that would presumably make it a Nickel-Iron ( NiFe ) cell.

John

fidobsa · 21st Apr 2010, 7:53 am

My initial thought when I looked at the photo was it looks like a NiFe cell. We had them in the science labs at school in the early '70s.

Herald1360 · 21st Apr 2010, 12:40 pm

Aren't NiFe cells rechargeable and pretty much everlasting anyway? Also they only output about 1.2V.

I think the "long shelf life" theory sounds most plausible. A bit like the "air" cells that are activated by peeling off a vent seal or dry charged car batteries.

Alan Stepney · 21st Apr 2010, 3:04 pm

I dont think it was a constant voltage cell. The only ones I remember and the most common, were the Weston cell and it certainly isnt one of those.

It appears to have been well used, with several different lines around the cork.

So, I decided to try the obvious. Pour in tap water and see what happens.
To my surprise, no, amazement, it produces 1.3-1.4 volts (for some reason it varies), and happily runs a 1.35v torch bulb.
(It is marked, 1.5 volts.)

I cant see inside to check the construction, but when I can find my litmus paper, will see what the ph is of the water now.

XTC · 21st Apr 2010, 3:18 pm

I've got a physics book from the 50s which talks about a Gordon Magnesium Cell. The negative electrode is a magnesium rod and the positive electrode is a carbon cylinder and the electrolyte is tap water. It says they were only expected to deliver about about 100mA and were used in deaf aids.

That's the only place I've ever heard of it.

Presumably, a cell like that would have definite advantages which made it useful in some applications, such as indefinite shelf life and ease of activation.

Pete.

Mr Moose · 21st Apr 2010, 3:38 pm

Hello,
There are standby batteries which need a long shelf life and to prevent self discharge are supplied dry and are only activated on addition of water.
See :- http://www.mpoweruk.com/water.htm
Yours, Richard

Reelman · 21st Apr 2010, 5:13 pm

I bought one of these ex-gov from Jobstocks in Walthamstow in '67. As a kid I thought it would last forever....just keep replacing the water. Not so, of course.

Does anyone else remember Jobstocks? If so we had better start a new thread.

Cheers,

Peter

Alan Stepney · 21st Apr 2010, 5:47 pm

Many thanks Richard.
I was sure someone would know.

McMurdo · 21st Apr 2010, 9:15 pm

I had a batch of these given to me by my uncle when I was a boy, I added water and they certainly worked, (getting the water in was fiddly) but all my torch bulbs (my 'toys') were 2.5v or 3.5V and so I lost interest when they only lit-up dimly.

I still have them somewhere.

AC/HL · 22nd Apr 2010, 12:11 am

I also have one somewhere, salvaged from a derelict part of a hotel in India!
I believe they are a standard Leclanche cell, just dessicated until activated.

michael cumming · 6th May 2010, 6:44 pm

Not seen this one before from BEREC, British Eveready export company. Im sure i have seen something like this battery that was used by the army but you could urinate in it to activate it in an emergency, I have seen a cell like this in an Antique shop an thats what the old bloke who worked in there told me. It had a MOD arrow on it. I dont think this battery featured here is one of these as the one i saw was made of metal. I could be wrong but it may have been made this way so it would not degrade with electrolite. You added it when you wanted to use it. There is another battery called the Aston cell that you added water to charge, It is a ceramic jar with a dolly wrap core with a carbon rod for + and a zinc rod -. It has The Aston WO Cell water only required to charge this cell written on it. I will post a pic on F Book site at some point.

20th Apr 2010, 7:39 pm	#1
Alan Stepney Rest in Peace Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Dorset, UK. Posts: 947	An odd battery One I have never come across before. Berec 659 inert cell. On the back it says, Remove cork and vent plug and fill slowly with fresh drinking water. Anyone seen one before? What were they for? Attached Thumbnails

20th Apr 2010, 8:20 pm	#2
kalee20 Dekatron Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Lynton, N. Devon, UK. Posts: 7,094	Re: An odd battery There were cells which didn't produce power, but dropped a constant voltage when current was passed through (a sort of electrolytic Zener diode). Could it be one of these?

20th Apr 2010, 8:29 pm	#3
helmsman Tetrode Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Southampton, Hampshire, UK. Posts: 56	Re: An odd battery Or could it be a salt cell ?

20th Apr 2010, 8:34 pm	#4
Sean Williams Dekatron Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: St.Ippolyts, Hitchin, Hertfordshire QRA IO91UW Posts: 3,520	Re: An odd battery I think the cell is filled with dried potassium hydroxide - this is then turned into a liquid electrolyte paste with the addition of water. I think this was done to give the cells a long shelf life. __________________ Engineers make things work and have spare bits when finished

21st Apr 2010, 7:53 am	#6
fidobsa Retired Dormant Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Zala, Hungary Posts: 418	Re: An odd battery My initial thought when I looked at the photo was it looks like a NiFe cell. We had them in the science labs at school in the early '70s.

21st Apr 2010, 12:40 pm	#7
Herald1360 Dekatron Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Leominster, Herefordshire, UK. Posts: 16,536	Re: An odd battery Aren't NiFe cells rechargeable and pretty much everlasting anyway? Also they only output about 1.2V. I think the "long shelf life" theory sounds most plausible. A bit like the "air" cells that are activated by peeling off a vent seal or dry charged car batteries. __________________ ....__________ ....\|____\|\|__\|__\_____ .=.\| _---\__\|__\|_---_\|. .........O..Chris....O

21st Apr 2010, 3:04 pm	#8
Alan Stepney Rest in Peace Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Dorset, UK. Posts: 947	Re: An odd battery I dont think it was a constant voltage cell. The only ones I remember and the most common, were the Weston cell and it certainly isnt one of those. It appears to have been well used, with several different lines around the cork. So, I decided to try the obvious. Pour in tap water and see what happens. To my surprise, no, amazement, it produces 1.3-1.4 volts (for some reason it varies), and happily runs a 1.35v torch bulb. (It is marked, 1.5 volts.) I cant see inside to check the construction, but when I can find my litmus paper, will see what the ph is of the water now.

21st Apr 2010, 3:18 pm	#9
XTC Retired Dormant Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Bristol, UK. Posts: 837	Re: An odd battery I've got a physics book from the 50s which talks about a Gordon Magnesium Cell. The negative electrode is a magnesium rod and the positive electrode is a carbon cylinder and the electrolyte is tap water. It says they were only expected to deliver about about 100mA and were used in deaf aids. That's the only place I've ever heard of it. Presumably, a cell like that would have definite advantages which made it useful in some applications, such as indefinite shelf life and ease of activation. Pete.

21st Apr 2010, 3:38 pm	#10
Mr Moose Octode Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Gloucestershire, UK. Posts: 1,043	Re: An odd battery Hello, There are standby batteries which need a long shelf life and to prevent self discharge are supplied dry and are only activated on addition of water. See :- http://www.mpoweruk.com/water.htm Yours, Richard

21st Apr 2010, 5:13 pm	#11
Reelman Octode Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Rotherham, South Yorkshire, UK. Posts: 1,726	Re: An odd battery I bought one of these ex-gov from Jobstocks in Walthamstow in '67. As a kid I thought it would last forever....just keep replacing the water. Not so, of course. Does anyone else remember Jobstocks? If so we had better start a new thread. Cheers, Peter

21st Apr 2010, 5:47 pm	#12
Alan Stepney Rest in Peace Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Dorset, UK. Posts: 947	Re: An odd battery Many thanks Richard. I was sure someone would know.

21st Apr 2010, 9:15 pm	#13
McMurdo Dekatron Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Staffordshire Moorlands, UK. Posts: 5,277	Re: An odd battery I had a batch of these given to me by my uncle when I was a boy, I added water and they certainly worked, (getting the water in was fiddly) but all my torch bulbs (my 'toys') were 2.5v or 3.5V and so I lost interest when they only lit-up dimly. I still have them somewhere. __________________ Kevin

22nd Apr 2010, 12:11 am	#14
AC/HL Dekatron Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Heckmondwike, West Yorkshire, UK. Posts: 9,643	Re: An odd battery I also have one somewhere, salvaged from a derelict part of a hotel in India! I believe they are a standard Leclanche cell, just dessicated until activated.

6th May 2010, 6:44 pm	#15
michael cumming Retired Dormant Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Durham Posts: 205	Re: An odd battery Not seen this one before from BEREC, British Eveready export company. Im sure i have seen something like this battery that was used by the army but you could urinate in it to activate it in an emergency, I have seen a cell like this in an Antique shop an thats what the old bloke who worked in there told me. It had a MOD arrow on it. I dont think this battery featured here is one of these as the one i saw was made of metal. I could be wrong but it may have been made this way so it would not degrade with electrolite. You added it when you wanted to use it. There is another battery called the Aston cell that you added water to charge, It is a ceramic jar with a dolly wrap core with a carbon rod for + and a zinc rod -. It has The Aston WO Cell water only required to charge this cell written on it. I will post a pic on F Book site at some point.