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Old 4th Jan 2019, 6:06 pm   #381
'LIVEWIRE?'
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Default Re: Radio Caroline to return on Medium Wave.

Basically yes, Russell, although I always understood that the main reason for the use of 'in-house' cover versions, was due to the fact that the 'Needle Time' restrictions then in force only permitted a small number of records to be played per hour.
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Old 4th Jan 2019, 6:21 pm   #382
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Default Re: Radio Caroline to return on Medium Wave.

That was what the BBC was doing before the start of radio 1.

Around that time the BBC was not serving younger people at all well. Oddly enough they broadcast the real versions of popular music in the wartime era and saw no need to use cover versions. In the 1960s, I well remember the light programme and how they had a small stable of house singers who had to trot out just about everything. It felt rather unsatisfying at the time. Luxembourg and Caroline gave us the real thing.

The record industry had many years of fleecing the record-buying public so they get little sympathy from those of us who lived through the era.

Nowadays things are changing. It looks like copyright has been extended to the point where it is becoming difficult to write new material without facing litigation from the estate of deceased writers of anything with any similarities. We face the entertainment of watching the entertainers trying to tear each other's throats out, figuratively speaking.

I gather the last extension of copyright was championed by one studio trying to extend the date before its cartoons went public domain. The jump in length of coverage has created the bizarre situation where there was a 20 year hiatus in copyrights lapsing. and some newer material got longer protection than older material.

Compare this against how long a patent lasts.
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Old 4th Jan 2019, 7:03 pm   #383
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Default Re: Radio Caroline to return on Medium Wave.

Thanks for that, folks. I knew about 'Flowers in the Rain' playing on Radio 1 but must've got mixed up about the cover recordings used to adulterate the music progs. And yes - there'd be all sorts of contracts and machinations about 'needle-time' etc...

All very archaic looking back!
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Old 4th Jan 2019, 7:05 pm   #384
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Default Re: Radio Caroline to return on Medium Wave.

It’s good to recall how much I enjoyed listening to the pirates (and to an extent Radio 1, particularly the ex-pirate DJs) but I was in my mid-teens then. All-day music radio seemed wonderful, with an element of MW DX-ing thrown in. By the time commercial radio actually arrived, I’d got older, my tastes had changed to the extent that I found it unlistenable, and I ended up as a Radio 4 listener.

Wasn’t ‘needle time’ something demanded by the Musician’s Union?

My choice of all-day music listening these days is Radio Dismuke...!
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Old 4th Jan 2019, 9:46 pm   #385
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Default Re: Radio Caroline to return on Medium Wave.

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Originally Posted by 'LIVEWIRE?' View Post
Basically yes, Russell, although I always understood that the main reason for the use of 'in-house' cover versions, was due to the fact that the 'Needle Time' restrictions then in force only permitted a small number of records to be played per hour.
I remember Jimmy Young crooning some tunes on his show when Radio 1 started, recorded especially for it I guess?

I used to like listening to the Pirates, there was a good choice as we lived in Essex, mainly Caroline and London - I think there was one that played older stuff rather than the chart music? My Father sometimes listened to that one if I remember correctly.
I liked Radio one as well though when it started
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Old 5th Jan 2019, 12:04 am   #386
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Default Re: Radio Caroline to return on Medium Wave.

.....I think there was one that played older stuff rather than the chart music? My Father sometimes listened to that one if I remember correctly.

Yes, it was Radio 390, we listened to them a lot. I can still remember the words to one of their adverts for Silexine Paint, it was on so often and still in business!

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Old 5th Jan 2019, 11:36 am   #387
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Default Re: Radio Caroline to return on Medium Wave.

Yes, that was It, Radio 390

Where were they based? was that the one on the Fort?
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Old 5th Jan 2019, 12:17 pm   #388
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Default Re: Radio Caroline to return on Medium Wave.

Radio 390 were on Red Sands Fort in the Thames Estuary - I think they were the third station to occupy it, the others being KING Radio & Radio Invicta, neither of which lasted very long. Their style was almost like the Light Programme with commercials. IIRC, Ted Albeury, the station's owner had his announcers - he never to my knowledge called them Disc Jockeys-wear Dinner Jackets. One name I recall from 390 was Mike Raven.
As an aside, Shivering Sands Fort was first occupied by Radio Sutch, then Radio City.
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Old 5th Jan 2019, 6:57 pm   #389
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Default Re: Radio Caroline to return on Medium Wave.

Thanks for the info. I didn't realise that there were 2 Forts that had been used by the Pirate stations.
I seem to remember there was an episode of the 60s TV series " Danger Man" that had a setting of a Station on a Fort or similar.
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Old 5th Jan 2019, 7:29 pm   #390
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Default Re: Radio Caroline to return on Medium Wave.

In the Thames Estuary there were seven WWII forts:

Red Sands (Radio 390, KING, Radio Invicta) and Shivering Sands (Radio City, Radio Sutch) were Army forts with several towers linked by gantries. There was another of this type of fort at The Nore but it was demolished before the advent of the pirate stations because its location made it a danger to shipping.

There were a set of Naval Forts which consisted of a platform on two hollow legs: Knock John (BBMS, Radio Essex), Sunk Head (Radio Tower), Tongue Sands and Roughs Tower.

All the towers except Roughs and Sunk Head were declared within territorial waters if the 'semicircle across the mouth of the bay' calculation (there had to be more water in the bay than in the area of the semicircle) was used. There was a lot of argument about Red Sands being within the three mile limit due to the exposure of Middle Sand sandbank - this was the basis of the original prosecution of Radio 390.

Tongue Sands off Margate was unstable as it had been attacked by enemy aircraft as it was being positioned and was sunk into the sea bed too quickly and had to be abandoned. Despite this, Roy Bates (Radio Essex) planned at one point to start Radio Kent from the tower. It eventually collapsed some time after the pirate radio era.

There was a battle for Roughs Tower between the Caroline organisation and Roy Bates which Bates eventually won. The Bates family still occupy the tower which, as its base had silted up, was declared Sealand, an independent state. The extension of territorial waters to twelve miles brings Roughs within the limit but Sealand remains. The Sealand story is an interesting story in its own right. Despite the battles and intrigue it seems no radio station has ever operated from it.

Sunk Head was blown up by the military late in 1967 to prevent its use by offshore stations.

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Old 5th Jan 2019, 7:34 pm   #391
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Default Re: Radio Caroline to return on Medium Wave.

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Originally Posted by music-centre View Post
I seem to remember there was an episode of the 60s TV series " Danger Man" that had a setting of a Station on a Fort or similar.
Steve.
"Not so Jolly Roger" episode was shot on Red Sands when Radio 390 were in occupation.

https://www.vintage-radio.net/forum/....php?p=1075210
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Old 5th Jan 2019, 11:02 pm   #392
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Default Re: Radio Caroline to return on Medium Wave.

Hello Nick,
Thanks for that, I had missed that thread about the Danger man episode, very interesting information about the Forts too, I didn't realise there were so many, I remember a Radio Essex and Radio Tower though, now you mention it.

We were spoilt for choice when listening to the Radio for that brief period in the 60s!
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