The Audiophoolery Thread.

[Radio Wrangler]

Originally Posted by G4YVM David

I'm in the wrong job. I could knock this stuff out and retire, except I'd get lost en route to my desert island because my moral compas needs re-swinging.

THere's just one flaw..... sure, you could make the silly cables, but as we all know they do nothing, so, it can't be the cables that people pay the money for. It's the flowery prose that they are buying, that and the bragging rights of being able to show someone a receipt with an incredible number on it, right after a script capital 'L'.

The fact that you're here in the audiophoolery thread and not repelled far , far, away, means that you must be incapable of writing the necessary bull to accompany those cables. Would you be able to stop laughing long enough?

David

[stevehertz]

Originally Posted by Radio Wrangler

THere's just one flaw..... sure, you could make the silly cables, but as we all know they do nothing, so, it can't be the cables that people pay the money for. It's the flowery prose that they are buying, that and the bragging rights of being able to show someone a receipt with an incredible number on it, right after a script capital 'L'.

The fact that you're here in the audiophoolery thread and not repelled far , far, away, means that you must be incapable of writing the necessary bull to accompany those cables. Would you be able to stop laughing long enough?

David

I'm a qualified electronics engineer and for the past 30+ years I've been in the marketing communications PR side of the business, writing press releases, articles, adverts, exhibition panels, company magazines, blogs etc etc. So I have the marketing and the technical skills to concoct such dribble. But I would never do that. Quite simply I hate anything that seeks to sell something to someone based on a pack of lies and untruths. Paradoxically I have little sympathy for those who fall for such rubbish, certainly in the world of hifi where victims actually get angry at people simply trying to help them see the truth.

[G4YVM David]

Originally Posted by Radio Wrangler

THere's just one flaw..... sure, you could make the silly cables, but as we all know they do nothing, so, it can't be the cables that people pay the money for. It's the flowery prose that they are buying, that and the bragging rights of being able to show someone a receipt with an incredible number on it, right after a script capital 'L'.

The fact that you're here in the audiophoolery thread and not repelled far , far, away, means that you must be incapable of writing the necessary bull to accompany those cables. Would you be able to stop laughing long enough?

David

I probably could write that stuff - I have penned my share in Shakespear's tongue - but you are correct...my laughter and my distress at flogging such snake oil would be beyond my capabilities. Its a disgrace really, though as you say, the buyer isnt really buying what is sold but something more subtle.

[wd40addict]

It would be really interesting to hear from someone who'd actually worked for one of these companies. What on earth goes on in R&D, if anything...

[stevehertz]

Originally Posted by wd40addict

It would be really interesting to hear from someone who'd actually worked for one of these companies. What on earth goes on in R&D, if anything...

Why! none other than testing that the directional flow of the neutrons is in sympathy with the negative molecules travelling at high speeds in the other direction in order to prompt a resultant nett zero level of distortion. The symbiosis of this situation gives rise to a number of added benefits including the fact that higher and lower frequencies share the same aural plain and thus provide for a more stable, coherent soundstage with no noticeable interruptions to the natural rhythm and 'drive' of the audio signal. Although novel, this methodology is not atypical of similar designs yet it ensures a much more reliable, more direct way of achieving a purity of sound level never before achieved by others.

[Craig Sawyers]

Originally Posted by wd40addict

It would be really interesting to hear from someone who'd actually worked for one of these companies. What on earth goes on in R&D, if anything...

At Kimber, it is a really nice Mormon guy called Verne Hansen. A hardened engineer who is restoring a valved theatre organ in one corner of the shop floor in his spare time. There was another chap, whose name I can't recall; he propelled himself off a cliff while mountain biking and suffered life changing injuries.

Kimber has been in business since 1971.

I also know the team at Russ Andrews, and a nicer bunch of people you could not wish to meet. They have been around since 1984.

Now there are opinions one way or the other about cable and audio accessory companies. But they are run by real people with wives, husbands and families, and believe in what they are doing. The two examples above are companies with integrity, and don't go into work with the attitude of "who are we going to fleece today?"

The exceptions by and large are USA based, and sell nonsense with zero technical credibility, using florid psuedoscience. This is a prime example https://www.synergisticresearch.com/ run by a real piece of work who posts on Facebook driving his Ferrari. Shun Mook (the ridiculous record clamp outfit) is another example. Not even with a pretense of engineering, or any measurable effect.

Of Synergistic Research Purple fuse (£190 to you, sir. Oh and by the way it takes 200 hours to break in) the website has this wonderful nonsense:

"Today physicists understand electrons don’t flow at all but rather propagate in a wave of energy that moves along a conductor with a multitude of factors that alters this wave at the quantum level. To understand how electricity travels without electrons ever leaving their respective atoms it is helpful to consider the spectator ‘wave’ at a football match. Even though you can clearly see a wave pattern moving from spectator to spectator as fans raise and then lower their hands (without hands jumping from one person to the next), so too does electricity ‘move’ without electrons ever leaving their atoms. At Synergistic Research we’ve isolated key factors that affect how electricity propagates by changing the behavior of electrons through Inductive Quantum Coupling methods we collectively call UEF Tech. In fact, UEF Tech is so powerful even an electrical chain several miles long is fundimentally improved with nothing more than a single fuse engineered with our patented UEF Technology"

UEF, by the way, stands for Uniform Energy Field; whatever that might be. Note the misspelling of fundamentally.

[The Philpott]

No takers for a Shun Mook Mpingo Cable Tree, then. Mark's reference to Viz magazine's spoof limited editions only fully hit home when i saw the analogue seduction site, then i laughed so hard i thought i'd get complaints from 'M' downstairs.

Last year I found a lovely large lump of quartz with molybdenite crystals on one side, i wonder if it has properties i can exploit someone with..

On the basis that any publicity is good publicity (up to a point) there could be merit perceived in putting something utterly ridiculous on a sales website to simply attract attention to the manufacturer...who also supplies cheaper items. Shock tactics attract attention..is this what's going on?

Dave

[mark_in_manc]

I'm not sure what is going on! I'm glad someone looked at the dambusters clock plate etc etc

Part of my (self-)righteous indignation around all this is driven by knowing someone whose Dad spent their rent money on this kind of thing (quite a while ago - my friend is my age, 50-ish). OK, it could have been at the pub, or the bookies, or on fancy women...but nevertheless, it is not a victimless crime. Like a lot of frauds, it exploits a weakness in the mark - some scams target greed, this one in my view targets vanity. But so do fancy cars, and perhaps even fancy radios and tellies. Mine's bigger than yours

[Ted Kendall]

Originally Posted by stevehertz

Why! none other than testing that the directional flow of the neutrons is in sympathy with the negative molecules travelling at high speeds in the other direction in order to prompt a resultant nett zero level of distortion. The symbiosis of this situation gives rise to a number of added benefits including the fact that higher and lower frequencies share the same aural plain and thus provide for a more stable, coherent soundstage with no noticeable interruptions to the natural rhythm and 'drive' of the audio signal. Although novel, this methodology is not atypical of similar designs yet it ensures a much more reliable, more direct way of achieving a purity of sound level never before achieved by others.

There you are - top quality BS.

[Radio Wrangler]

But the other brand's got nano-wormhole toroidal singularities performing chronosic re-alignment. Decisions, decisions.

David

[Beobloke]

Originally Posted by Craig Sawyers

I also know the team at Russ Andrews, and a nicer bunch of people you could not wish to meet. They have been around since 1984.
.

I know exactly what you mean, Craig. I've had the pleasure of meeting John Rogers and his wife Angela, who own Ringmat Developments and they are two of the nicest people I have ever had the pleasure of encountering within the hi-fi industry.

Sadly, this makes listening to his 'interesting' theories on stuff and how brilliant the crazy things the company offers all the more hard to take.

For those who don't know the company or its products, a small selection below...

http://www.ringmat.com/products/statfeet.htm

http://www.ringmat.com/products/statmat.htm

http://www.ringmat.com/products/ringmatfeet.htm

[Craig Sawyers]

Chronosic pales into insignificance, David, as compared with the Wilson Audio WAMM Master Chronosonic loudspeaker at £700k

https://hifilounge.co.uk/product/wil...-loudspeakers/

Now it is a thing of engineering beauty weighing 400kg each, with shots of how they are made in the brochure

http://hifilounge.co.uk/wp-content/u...-full-line.pdf

Now Wilson are a very serious outfit, the company outliving the founder, and is now run by his son.

Even the bookshelf sized speakers are £11k!

[Craig Sawyers]

Originally Posted by Beobloke

[

I know exactly what you mean, Craig. I've had the pleasure of meeting John Rogers and his wife Angela, who own Ringmat Developments and they are two of the nicest people I have ever had the pleasure of encountering within the hi-fi industry.

Sadly, this makes listening to his 'interesting' theories on stuff and how brilliant the crazy things the company offers all the more hard to take.

For those who don't know the company or its products, a small selection below...

http://www.ringmat.com/products/statfeet.htm

http://www.ringmat.com/products/statmat.htm

http://www.ringmat.com/products/ringmatfeet.htm

I have to fess up and say I have a Ringmat. I tried it out on my Garrard 401/SMEIV/DL103 and have to say I could not hear any difference at all, improvement or otherwise. I ended up with a cork mat, and the Ringmat sits in glorious isolation next to the record collection.

The thing that might possibly work is the CD mat. Malcolm Hawkesford (a Professor at Exxex U) measured the focus tracking signal and found that it had a distorted version of the audio from the speakers. So although the supposed benefit of the mat is electrostatic control, it could be introducing mechanical damping of CD resonances in response to the acoustic field from the speakers.

[Beobloke]

Originally Posted by Craig Sawyers

Now Wilson are a very serious outfit, the company outliving the founder, and is now run by his son.

Even the bookshelf sized speakers are £11k!

Don't get me started on these!

Now, I'm sure they're very good - I don't know; I've not heard them. However that £11k doesn't include grilles, which are an extra £335. Don't want grilles? Then you'll be wanting the metal trim rings for the woofers, to hide their fixing screws. Yours for £698!

And the icing on the cake? The trim rings a introduce a measurable glitch in the frequency response at 3kHz.

I don't know about you, but I'm not impressed.

[Beobloke]

Originally Posted by Craig Sawyers

So although the supposed benefit of the mat is electrostatic control, it could be introducing mechanical damping of CD resonances in response to the acoustic field from the speakers.

I very much doubt it - its a thin piece of plastic with some ink drawings on it. Its damping properties are minimal.

[stevehertz]

[QUOTE=Craig Sawyers;1431259]

Originally Posted by Beobloke

[



The thing that might possibly work is the CD mat. Malcolm Hawkesford (a Professor at Exxex U) measured the focus tracking signal and found that it had a distorted version of the audio from the speakers. So although the supposed benefit of the mat is electrostatic control, it could be introducing mechanical damping of CD resonances in response to the acoustic field from the speakers.

Yes but 'all that is measurable' may not have any real effect on where it matters - the sound that reaches our ears. It's like people have analysed the 'effects' of different types of capacitors, and indeed it is proven there are differences, but in most cases the differences (mainly associated with how frequency affects how a capacitor behaves) are way outside of what would affect what we hear. I'm not saying that there are no cases where caps choice does not affect the sound, but a lot of it does fall out of bounds.

[Radio Wrangler]

A defining characteristic of a true audiophile is an unshakable belief that there is no limit to the discriminating ability of the human ear.... maybe not their own ear, but at least those of the gurus they follow.

The unavoidable consequence of this is an unshakeable belief that no impairment of any sort is ever too small to not be significant. And off they go, locked onto an eternal quest for some sort of holy grail. It keeps them off the streets.

David

[The Philpott]

It must be a lonely existence.

Curiously POA ('Price on application') is shown less than in the past. I have always taken it to mean a combination of a) If you have to ask the price, you can't afford it b) if you have bought from us before, you have influential contacts and you never complain, you can have a discount.

The other POA is of course Power of Attorney, which someone who pays thousands of pounds for a piece of ebony would be well advised to research.

Dave

and a nicer bunch of people you could not wish to meet

There is the old saying "If you can fake sincerity"...

[Brigham]

People WANT to believe.

Don't forget, the most insincere man on television's catch phrase was "I mean that most sincerely...".