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Old 19th Mar 2019, 1:11 pm   #481
Craig Sawyers
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Default Re: Audiophoolery?

What is in the box? Do you want to open the box?

https://www.futureshop.co.uk/entreq-...lus-ground-box

Is it a booby prize?
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Old 19th Mar 2019, 1:23 pm   #482
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Default Re: Audiophoolery?

That sounds like the upmarket version of this:

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Old 19th Mar 2019, 1:39 pm   #483
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Default Re: Audiophoolery?

The review is hilarious.
“It can be used to reach to top shelf since the step ladder was stolen”
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Old 19th Mar 2019, 1:43 pm   #484
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You couldn't make it up! Re #61, I rather liked

"When you connect your system to one of their groundboxes you offer this high frequence stay voltages a ground point where they can find peace instead of flowing arround in the system."
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Old 19th Mar 2019, 1:49 pm   #485
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Default Re: Audiophoolery?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Radio Wrangler View Post

No, I think it's exclusivity that draws them in, the feeling that everyone (except their gods) are excluded from enjoying something they have. Something that elevates them to a smugness factor of at least 100 milliRobinsons. It needs to be something requiring any one of : great wealth, great luck, special friendships with gurus, or serious skills as a hunter-gatherer to obtain.

David
Given that the exclusivity level of your own system is a given, and your friendships with gurus noted, how are your hunter-gatherer skills, David?


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Old 19th Mar 2019, 1:49 pm   #486
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Love the review!

But it's made me think - earthing to Earth can pick up all sorts of nasties, as they say. An isolated oak box won't have that problem, but it's a bit small. So, how much would it cost to run an 'earth' cable, to, say, the Moon? I might have to buy a square foot of surface first... And I can't decide whether the 'earth' stake should be copper, silver, or something exotic. Decisions, decisions!
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Old 19th Mar 2019, 2:29 pm   #487
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The thing that all this ground nonsense entirely forgets that neither airplanes or space vehicles have any connection to ground. And generally planes do not fall out of the sky and space vehicles work - such as GPS satellites.

Like many snake oil merchants forget is that there is a difference between a signal's zero voltage reference (against which signal voltages are compared) and safety ground.

Look upon the equipment as being a Faraday cage (IOW the equipment enclosure) in which the circuit is located. The zero voltage reference is connected to the Faraday cage. Then for ground based audio you connect the Faraday cage to safety ground for - er - safety. What the safety ground is doing in detail is entirely irrelevant.

The only time that safety ground can be problematic is when a hum loop is a problem - but that is 99% of the time is a result of plugging different pieces of gear into different wall outlets.

Craig
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Old 19th Mar 2019, 3:16 pm   #488
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kalee20 View Post
Love the review!

So, how much would it cost to run an 'earth' cable, to, say, the Moon? I might have to buy a square foot of surface first... And I can't decide whether the 'earth' stake should be copper, silver, or something exotic. Decisions, decisions!
Obvious answer:

Selenium!

David
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Old 19th Mar 2019, 5:20 pm   #489
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Default Re: Audiophoolery?

No such thing as a Faraday cage. A Faraday shield however is one which lets through the H field and screens the E field. He did this to prove it was the magnetic field that makes a transformer work.
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Old 19th Mar 2019, 6:37 pm   #490
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Default Re: Audiophoolery?

...But there is such a thing as semantic drift
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Old 19th Mar 2019, 8:24 pm   #491
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No such thing as a Faraday cage ...
I think there is. They're even available to buy

https://www.techmfg.com/products/fie...n/faradaycages

You're right that they don't screen magnetic fields out though (at least not low-frequency ones).

Cheers,

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Old 20th Mar 2019, 12:46 am   #492
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Default Re: Audiophoolery?

A surprising number of people say Faraday cage or Faraday screen whenever they are thinking of screening in general.

But as Faraday screens are special ones designed to let magnetic fields straight through, it's a bit like always prefixing the word 'Tyre' with the modifier 'Flat'.

David
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Old 20th Mar 2019, 1:37 am   #493
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You couldn't make it up! Re #61, I rather liked

"When you connect your system to one of their groundboxes you offer this high frequence stay voltages a ground point where they can find peace instead of flowing arround in the system."

It's just so far out there, as David said in #5 plenty of free entertainment.
Whats in one of these boxes and if I took the lid off would it double up as a cat litter?
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Old 20th Mar 2019, 7:37 am   #494
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I can't even imagine what is in there that weighs 46kg. Sand?

Actually, at one point I designed a security gate (the sort you see in supermarkets etc to stop you nicking stuff with a tag) with a class D power amp feeding the coils. It therefore needed a filter on the output. That had a monster inductor on a ferrite core, and it warbled irritatingly at low kHz as a result of magnetostriction.

Although, with the help of ISVR at Southampton I shut it up in an engineeringly satisfactory way, I initially proved the point by:

Filling the filter box with sand.

Worked just fine, apart from weighing lots. Although not 46kg by a long shot!

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Old 20th Mar 2019, 7:50 am   #495
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Default Re: Audiophoolery?

Quote:
Originally Posted by GrimJosef View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by merlinmaxwell View Post
No such thing as a Faraday cage ...
I think there is. They're even available to buy

https://www.techmfg.com/products/fie...n/faradaycages

You're right that they don't screen magnetic fields out though (at least not low-frequency ones).

Cheers,

GJ
Thanks for the link - interesting product.

They have active magnetic field cancellation too, so they do screen magnetic fields.

Cheers

Craig

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Old 20th Mar 2019, 8:45 am   #496
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Default Re: Audiophoolery?

Whatever you do, don't open the box!

The manufacturer says that the drain wires feed all the nasty interference down into the ground box. The box is otherwise closed, so there is nowhere further for the evil to go. It can only build up in the box and opening it will let all the collected bad stuff out.

These boxes could be quite dangerous and must eventually burst in a really bad-sounding explosion. It is safer to forgo their benefits and tolerate some long term sonic imperfection.

Perhaps true audiophiles only keep their boxes for a short while, replacing them with new ones and palming the filled ones off onto some unsuspecting mug? Could be reassuringly expensive.

David
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Old 20th Mar 2019, 10:30 am   #497
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Default Re: Audiophoolery?

Going back to threads for fasteners, it isn't the thread form that is important it is whether slot head or cross head screws are used. Cross head are better balanced so give rise to fewer unwanted resonances to upset the snake oil damping.
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Old 20th Mar 2019, 11:54 am   #498
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Hmmm.... snake oil and damping- would that be the killerpoise stuff?
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Old 20th Mar 2019, 12:37 pm   #499
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Whatever you do, don't open the box!

The manufacturer says that the drain wires feed all the nasty interference down into the ground box.
Ha ha! Looking at the size and weight, it has an average density of 3g/cc, or about 3.5g/cc once you have the wooden box off it.

If it was full to the brim with aluminium, it would be too light. Likewise sand - far, far too light too.

It could be about half full of either copper or iron. Or 1/3 full of lead.

One the vague offchance that there is something of real electrical merit in there, I'm betting on a monster iron cored inductor. That would allow fault currents to be connected to safety earth, but present a high impedance to any RF.

But then again, there is no approved ground connector there, so who knows.

Craig

PS have you read the only review for this thing? It is a hoot - it just has to be a send up.

"Incredible! I was not satisfied with the sound of my Hi-Fi system. The noise floor was way too high and the harmonics were all distorted. This also messed up the ultrasonic frequencies stopping me from enjoying my music to its full potential. Sure, I couldn't hear them, but the dog made it all too obvious.

The day my Entreq Olympus Tellus Ground Box arrived it was a day of great joy. Now when people came over, I could show them the receipt and watch them awe at the amount of money I spent on a wooden box.

Does it improve my listening experience? Absolutely! Now I can reach the top shelf where I have a bunch of CDs and listen to music that has been out of my reach for years since I had my stepladder stolen.

Not only that, I can also reach the top of my fridge, the closet and if I prop it on top of a chair, I can even reach the burnt out light bulbs!

My house has never looked brighter!"
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Old 20th Mar 2019, 12:59 pm   #500
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Nothing as scientific as an inductor! Some guy took the Tellus to bits. This is actually discontinued, but the Tellus II is 1380.

Basically it is some black granular stuff and some random bits of metal - brass strips with notches on the edge and some aluminium plates and sheet. And the construction standard of the box is horrid.

https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?...2581122&type=3

Wow. Just wow.
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